Jump to content

  • These forums are for "after booking" trip communications, socializing, and/or trip questions ONLY.
  • You will NOT be able to book a trip, buy add-ons, or manage your trip by logging in here. Please login HERE to do any of those things.

Photo

Advanced classes


  • Please log in to reply
13 replies to this topic

#1 Blublood

Blublood

    Everyone knows me

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 721 posts
  • Location:Albuquerque, NM
  • Gender:Male
  • Cert Level:Rescue / EFR
  • Logged Dives:200 +

Posted 24 March 2004 - 11:03 AM

Walter,

I didn't want to clog up Erin's link anymore but this is something I would love to talk to you more about. I actually picked that phrase up out of a "Dive Training" mag. I don't think it ment you don't learn in an AOW class but you learn enough to look at where you want to go and what you want to do so you may pick the direction you wish to travel to further your expeirence and education. I am very interested in learning everything I possibly can about this most wonderful sport. I can use all the input and guidance I might possibly be able to get. I would also like some input on the different training agencies and their differences up-sides and down sides. Any help you can give would be most appreciated.

Edited by Blublood, 24 March 2004 - 11:05 AM.

“There is no more unhappy thing than a man who has accomplished all his ends in life.â€

#2 Walter

Walter

    I need to get a life

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,549 posts
  • Location:Lehigh Acres, Florida
  • Gender:Male
  • Cert Level:Instructor
  • Logged Dives:4 digits

Posted 24 March 2004 - 11:26 AM

I believe this topic deserves its own thread, so I split it off on its own.

A agree we were starting to hijack that thread and it's good you moved the discussion over to training where it belongs.

That phrase is an indication of the trend in dive training. Some agencies are taking the meat out of their (some did so long ago) courses and using phrases like that to cover their tracks, to convince people the classes are still worth taking.

While there are excellent instructors who add to course requirements and actually teach a true advanced class, they are the exception and not the rule.

I strongly support the concept of advanced classes. I teach an advanced class, it includes lots of academics and 10 dives. The direction many agencies have gone with AOW makes the class a waste of time.

I strongly recommend searching carefully for an advanced class. If you live in southern California, you have access to one of the best programs anywhere - LA County's Advanced Diver program.

Walter
No single raindrop believes it is responsible for the flood.

DSSW,

WWW™

#3 Blublood

Blublood

    Everyone knows me

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 721 posts
  • Location:Albuquerque, NM
  • Gender:Male
  • Cert Level:Rescue / EFR
  • Logged Dives:200 +

Posted 24 March 2004 - 12:16 PM

Thanks Walter. I will take it then from your words that one would want to be aware of who your instructor actually is and is about rather than any particular agency or school. very good advice thank you.

I already moved across town once and am glad I did. I have found not only from a training standpoint but an equipment standpoint who you deal with makes a great difference. The LDS where I did my OW really tried to shove some equipment down my throat as soon as I finished class...The whole you have ten days for your ten percent discount thing. it was like buying a car. The next shop I went to said here...what do want to go try out and loaded me up with different equipment to try out on my next trip. The same went for the AOW class I took there.
“There is no more unhappy thing than a man who has accomplished all his ends in life.â€

#4 Walter

Walter

    I need to get a life

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,549 posts
  • Location:Lehigh Acres, Florida
  • Gender:Male
  • Cert Level:Instructor
  • Logged Dives:4 digits

Posted 24 March 2004 - 01:17 PM

Actually, that's not what I said.

While most agencies have gutted their AOW classes, AOW isn't the only choice for an advanced class. There are ways of shopping by agency that virtually assures an excellent advanced program.

As I mentioned earlier, LA County has probably the best advanced class anywhere. NAUI has a Master Diver program that is, in actuality, an excellent advanced program. YMCA has an excellent program with their Siver Advanced class. Combined with their Gold Master Diver course, it rivals any class anywhere. I don't recommend YMCA's AOW course.

Walter
No single raindrop believes it is responsible for the flood.

DSSW,

WWW™

#5 Blublood

Blublood

    Everyone knows me

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 721 posts
  • Location:Albuquerque, NM
  • Gender:Male
  • Cert Level:Rescue / EFR
  • Logged Dives:200 +

Posted 24 March 2004 - 06:28 PM

Thanks Walter,

Apologize for misunderstanding you. I thought you were saying that "by the book" most advanced clases were not really that good but could be if you had an instructor who cared enough to incorporate more learning more dives etc as you said you did in your classes.
“There is no more unhappy thing than a man who has accomplished all his ends in life.â€

#6 Walter

Walter

    I need to get a life

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,549 posts
  • Location:Lehigh Acres, Florida
  • Gender:Male
  • Cert Level:Instructor
  • Logged Dives:4 digits

Posted 24 March 2004 - 06:45 PM

Actually, I did say that, but it is rare to find such instructors, possibly extremely rare. A better bet is to look for classes that are designed to be true advanced classes.

While it is true that all agencies have good and bad instructors, the statement is usually used as a cop out to place blame for poorly designed courses on an instructor when the agency is responsible. If an instructor follows standards to the letter and the course isn't much good, the instructor isn't to blame.

Agencies design their courses by writing standards. Those standards vary a great deal. You'll hear that all agencies follow RSTC or WRSTC standards and therefore have the same standards, but that's a misleading statement as well. Some agencies never exceed those minimums, while others routinely exceed them.
No single raindrop believes it is responsible for the flood.

DSSW,

WWW™

#7 Blublood

Blublood

    Everyone knows me

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 721 posts
  • Location:Albuquerque, NM
  • Gender:Male
  • Cert Level:Rescue / EFR
  • Logged Dives:200 +

Posted 24 March 2004 - 09:40 PM

Thanks Walter. Many new divers like myself want nothing more than to learn to be the most consiensies ( is there a spell check on this thing!) and best divers we can. I like so many others know we can only lean on those who have the ability and understanding to want to share their knowledge and then go on to share that knowledge with others. Myself, I hpoe to go on to some kind of reef, oceanic preseritive type of use of my skills.....e shall see I guess. I really look forward to diving with you someday and hope after you dive with me you will look forward t diving with me again! To our sterns be the trades and tides with calm seas ahead. Gar
“There is no more unhappy thing than a man who has accomplished all his ends in life.â€

#8 Walter

Walter

    I need to get a life

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,549 posts
  • Location:Lehigh Acres, Florida
  • Gender:Male
  • Cert Level:Instructor
  • Logged Dives:4 digits

Posted 25 March 2004 - 05:47 PM

Gar,

I'm looking forward to diving with you as well. Have a blast in the Keys!

Walter
No single raindrop believes it is responsible for the flood.

DSSW,

WWW™

#9 No Pressure

No Pressure

    People are starting to get to know me

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 472 posts
  • Location:Austin, TX
  • Gender:Male
  • Board Status:occasionally bored
  • Cert Level:Master Diver/ Some tech stuff. Now mostly just jump in, float, breathe, get in the zone.
  • Logged Dives:1500+

Posted 08 April 2004 - 07:30 PM

I chose the NAUI master diver program after talking with instructors from a number of LDS's representing a number of "certifying agencies". Some were the "pay your money and get your card" style. I fully agree that it is both the expectations of the student, as well as the skills of the instructor that determine how much you get out of a class. I would add that all classes really only teach us enough to ask better questions. Finishing a class means that you can then start pursuing more in depth answers.
Diving; My zen space.

#10 chinacat46

chinacat46

    I spend too much time on line

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,147 posts
  • Location:Lafayette, CO
  • Gender:Male
  • Cert Level:OWSI
  • Logged Dives:1527(8 in fresh water)

Posted 08 April 2004 - 07:40 PM

:sweetie: Doesn't PADI stand for Put Another Dollar In?

#11 Marvel

Marvel

    I spend too much time on line

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,057 posts
  • Location:Lauderdale By The Sea, FL
  • Gender:Female
  • Cert Level:AOW, Nitrox
  • Logged Dives:200+

Posted 08 April 2004 - 09:03 PM

While there are excellent instructors who add to course requirements and actually teach a true advanced class, they are the exception and not the rule.

I strongly support the concept of advanced classes. I teach an advanced class, it includes lots of academics and 10 dives. The direction many agencies have gone with AOW makes the class a waste of time.

I strongly recommend searching carefully for an advanced class.

Sound advice, Walter. I got my OW from PADI last May/June & felt that I should put in some dive time before pursuing more advanced certifications. I was not impressed with the instruction that I received, to put it mildly. A house is only as strong as its foundation.

Some of the discussions that I have read here having to do with actually practicing the skills that I was taught have made me even more aware that experience and good sound basics are critical to my advancement & enjoyment of diving. Concious attempts at mastery have always characterized my involvement in other sports, how much more important is that level of commitment in one that is potentially fatal? Certainly, after a winter off, I know my underwater skills are rusty & I need to sharpen them up a little before moving on. That's one reason that I am looking forward to diving weith you and many of the other members of this group- it is apparent to me that, despite the joking around that we do, this is a bunch of people who are devoted to diving & have a lot of combined knowledge that I can benefit from. I hope that I will be able to pass some of that knowledge on to someone else some day.

(Now, back to the light-hearted version of Marvel) :sweetie:
Marvel

"I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen: not only because I see it, but because by it I see everything else." C. S. Lewis



Posted Image

#12 Walter

Walter

    I need to get a life

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,549 posts
  • Location:Lehigh Acres, Florida
  • Gender:Male
  • Cert Level:Instructor
  • Logged Dives:4 digits

Posted 09 April 2004 - 06:37 AM

Marvel,

We'll get together soon and get you practicing your skills on some fun dives.
No single raindrop believes it is responsible for the flood.

DSSW,

WWW™

#13 Marvel

Marvel

    I spend too much time on line

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,057 posts
  • Location:Lauderdale By The Sea, FL
  • Gender:Female
  • Cert Level:AOW, Nitrox
  • Logged Dives:200+

Posted 09 April 2004 - 08:55 AM

Marvel,

We'll get together soon and get you practicing your skills on some fun dives.

I'm going to hold you to that!!!
Marvel

"I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen: not only because I see it, but because by it I see everything else." C. S. Lewis



Posted Image

#14 Walter

Walter

    I need to get a life

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,549 posts
  • Location:Lehigh Acres, Florida
  • Gender:Male
  • Cert Level:Instructor
  • Logged Dives:4 digits

Posted 09 April 2004 - 09:17 AM

Keep reminding me. I'm old, I forget.
No single raindrop believes it is responsible for the flood.

DSSW,

WWW™




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users