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Deep Diving anyone?


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#1 peterbj7

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Posted 24 January 2009 - 09:06 PM

Salvagers claim to have found the world's richest wreck – a British ship sunk by a Nazi submarine while laden with a £2.6 billion cargo that included gold, platinum and diamonds.

In a project shrouded in secrecy, work is due to start on recovering the cargo, which was being transported to the United States to help pay for the Allied effort in the Second World War.

The scale of the treasure trove is likely to unleash a series of competing claims from interested parties. Salvage laws are notoriously complex and experts say there could be many years of legal wrangling ahead.

In order to protect its find until the cargo is brought to the surface, the company that located the wreck has not released the name of the vessel or its exact location, but has given the ship the code name "Blue Baron".

It says the merchant ship, which had a predominantly British crew, had left a European port, laden with goods for the US Treasury under the Lend-Lease scheme, whereby the American government gave material support to the Allied war effort in exchange for payments.

The Blue Baron first sailed to a port in South America, where it unloaded some general cargo, before continuing north in a convoy, heading for New York.

However, the company claim it was intercepted by German U-boat U87 and sent to the bottom by two torpedoes in June 1942, with the loss of three crew members. Their nationalities are not known.

Sub Sea Research, a US-based marine research and recovery firm, claims it has now located the wreck under 800ft of water about 40 miles off Guyana.

Greg Brooks, the company's founder and co-manager, said: "This British freighter had an extremely valuable cargo and we decided there wasn't a lot of point in leaving it at the bottom of the sea. This will definitely be the richest wreck ever."

Until now, historians have not credited U87 with sinking any vessels in that area in June 1942 and it was thought to have been operating further north in the Atlantic.

However, Sub Sea Research claims to have located the submarine's log book which prove it did sink the "Blue Baron", as well as documents from the port of origin, the US Treasury and the Lend-Lease programme giving clues as to what was on board.

A picture of the Blue Baron supplied to The Sunday Telegraph by the company shows it is a tramp steamer and her funnel appears to resemble those of the shipping line Hogarth and Co, of Glasgow, whose ships were known as Hungry Hogarths.

Tantalisingly, the names of its ships all began with the word Baron – indicating that the Blue Baron could be one of them. However, none of the fleet's 17 ships lost in the war appear to have been sunk in this area in June 1942.

The picture also resembles Port Nicholson, a steamer sunk by U87 in June 1942 but 2,000 miles north of Guyana off Cape Cod. Sub Sea Research insists that the Port Nicholson is not the Blue Baron.

It claims that the Blue Baron's cargo included at least ten tons of gold bullion, 70 tons of platinum, one a half tons of industrial diamonds and 16 million carats of gem quality diamonds.

In addition, there were several thousands tons of tin and a few thousand tons of copper ingots. Although the tin and copper may have lost some value after years on the sea bed, the precious metals and diamonds would not have done so.

The haul's total worth is calculated at £2.6 billion at today's prices, according to the firm.

Captain Richard Woodman, author of The Real Cruel Sea, a history of the merchant navy in the Second World War, said: "A lot of merchant ships did have to carry valuable cargoes like this.

Any heavy materials had to go by sea. It was the only way to get from A to B. There would have been an element of protection for them, but in the end it is just the coincidence of war that a ship happens to stop a torpedo."

A 220ft salvage vessel is currently being equipped to recover the cargo. It is due to sail next week from the US state of Louisiana to the wreck site, which lies in international waters.

The company has refused to reveal which government sent the valuables to the US or which was the Blue Baron's final port of call in Europe.

It is thought much of the treasure could be Russian, although part, including the diamonds, may have been British.

Britain and Russia were the two main beneficiaries of the Lend-Lease scheme, under which the US provided $50 billion of supplies - equivalent to $700 billion (£510 billion) in today's money.

Although explorers are permitted in law to stake claims on items they recover from the seabed, the original owners can make counter claims.

Sub Sea Research was forced to go public with its discovery when it filed a claim on the treasure in a US federal admiralty court, to which no counter claims have been lodged so far.

Mr Brooks said: "No one has stepped forward to make a claim yet, probably because the government that lost it does not realise.

"We are trying to keep it as quiet as possible until we have it in our possession. We think the possessions on board may belong to more than one country.

"I know for a fact that everyone possible will try to take it from us, but we are doing everything by the book. I think the worst case scenario, under salvage law, is that we would get 90 per cent of it. But we are trying to go for 100 per cent."

Mike Williams, an expert in salvage law at Wolverhampton University, said the Government which had owned the cargo would retain a strong claim on it.

He said: "Both Britain and Russia transhipped large quantities of precious goods to the US to pay for their war effort. It would be unlikely the salvors would be able to keep it all.

"The real winners will be the lawyers. There is a marine lawyers' saying that treasure is trouble."

#2 annasea

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Posted 24 January 2009 - 10:25 PM

Very interesting! I'll be watching this to see how it turns out. Thanks for posting, Peter.










#3 dustbowl diver

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Posted 25 January 2009 - 07:46 AM

Very interesting indeed! Will be curious to see how this all unfolds!!
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#4 Victoria

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Posted 01 February 2009 - 10:48 AM

Peter, here's another one...



Wreck of renowned British warship found in Channel
Source

TAMPA, Fla. – Florida deep-sea explorers who found $500 million in sunken treasure two years ago say they have discovered another prized shipwreck: A legendary British man-of-war that sank in the English Channel 264 years ago.

Odyssey Marine Exploration hasn't found any gold this time, but it's looking for an even bigger jackpot. The company's research indicates the HMS Victory was carrying 4 tons of gold coins that could be worth considerably more than the treasure that Odyssey raised from a sunken Spanish galleon in 2007, co-founder Greg Stemm said ahead of a news conference set for Monday in London.

So far, Odyssey has recovered two brass cannons from the wreck of the Victory and continues to examine and map the debris field, which lies about 330 feet beneath the surface, Stemm said. The company said it is negotiating with the British government over collaborating on the project.

"This is a big one, just because of the history," Stemm said. "Very rarely do you solve an age-old mystery like this."

Odyssey said the 31 brass cannons and other evidence on the wreck allowed definitive identification of the HMS Victory, 175-foot sailing ship that was separated from its fleet during a storm and sank in the English Channel on Oct. 4, 1744, with at least 900 men aboard. The ship was the largest and, with 110 brass cannons, the most heavily armed vessel of its day. It was the inspiration for the HMS Victory famously commanded by Adm. Horatio Nelson decades later.

Odyssey was searching for other valuable shipwrecks in the English Channel when it came across the Victory. Stemm wouldn't say exactly where the ship was found for fear of attracting plunderers, though he said it wasn't close to where it was expected to be.

"We found this more than 50 miles from where anybody would have thought it went down," Stemm said. Federal court records filed by Odyssey in Tampa seeking the exclusive salvage rights said the site is 25 to 40 miles from the English coast, outside of its territorial waters.

A Ministry of Defense spokesman said Sunday the government was aware of Odyssey's claim to have found the Victory.

"Assuming the wreck is indeed that of a British warship, her remains are sovereign immune," he said on condition of anonymity in keeping with government policy. "This means that no intrusive action may be taken without the express consent of the United Kingdom."

He would not say whether the government had begun talks with Odyssey over the future of the find.

Newspapers of the day and other historical records analyzed by the company indicated that the Victory sank off the Channel Island of Alderney near Cherbourg, France. A 1991 British postage stamp depicts the Victory crashing on the rocks there. Pieces of the ship had washed up in various places, but its final resting place had remained a mystery.

The belief that the Victory had crashed onto the rocks had marred an otherwise exemplary service record of the ship's commander, Sir John Balchin, and a lighthouse keeper on Alderney was prosecuted for failing to keep the light on. Odyssey believes the discovery exonerates both men.

"As far as the family is concerned, it is an astonishing revelation," said Robert Balchin, a 66-year-old British university administrator and direct descendant of the commander. "It's as if he's sort of come alive again.

"When I went to see this extraordinary find of the cannon with the coat of arms of the king on the side, it was really a wonderful feeling to know that Sir John Balchin saw that every day, and it brought a very special communion with the past."

The HMS Victory was returning from Lisbon, Portugal, and was probably transporting 100,000 gold Portuguese coins for merchants, according to Odyssey's research. The ship had sailed there to help rescue a Mediterranean convoy blockaded by the French in the River Tagus at Lisbon.

The wreck site is roughly 70 feet by 200 feet and littered with other debris, Odyssey said. Its research ship, Odyssey Explorer, is equipped with a remote underwater robot capable of carefully removing the smallest of items from the bottom and shooting high-resolution photos and video.

Odyssey, a publicly traded corporation, announced in May 2007 that it had raised 17 tons of silver coins from an Atlantic Ocean shipwreck. The company later said it believed the wreck to be the Spanish galleon Nuestra Senora de las Mercedes y las Animas, which sank off Portugal in 1804.

Shortly afterward, the Spanish government sued Odyssey in federal court in Tampa to claim the treasure, arguing that the shipwreck was never abandoned by Spain. The case is pending.

Some in the Spanish government have called the company 21st-century pirates, and twice in the months after the 2007 announcement, ships from Spain's Civil Guard seized Odyssey ships off the Spanish coast. Both ships and their crews were released within a week.

The company's relationship with the British government has been more cordial. Odyssey had already negotiated an agreement with British officials regarding the search for the HMS Sussex, which sank in the western Mediterranean in 1694 with gold coins aboard.

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#5 peterbj7

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Posted 01 February 2009 - 12:22 PM

Wonderful story! Interesting that the Spanish (speaking world) is still at loggerheads with the English (speaking world).

#6 peterbj7

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Posted 01 February 2009 - 12:26 PM

I was thinking about the earlier story. It gives the lie to those who thought Britain and Europe were the beneficiaries of American largesse during WWII and should be grateful for what they got. I'm not saying there isn't some truth to that, but clearly we were paying just a little for the help!

#7 Victoria

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Posted 01 February 2009 - 12:26 PM

Wonderful story! Interesting that the Spanish (speaking world) is still at loggerheads with the English (speaking world).


Well, ya know..... being the creatures of habit that we humans are... the headbutting betwixt the English speaking and Spanish speaking worlds has been motoring right along for the last 500+ years. Why change now?!? :wakawaka: Territorial tendencies die hardest, methinks.

(addendum)...to wit: the legal/geopolitical mess that Spain subjected Mel Fisher to when he found the Atocha.........

Edited by Victoria, 01 February 2009 - 12:28 PM.

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#8 shadragon

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Posted 01 February 2009 - 01:58 PM

While the UK received 49-50 billion in support from the USA (Among others), they did pay it back over a 50 year term (@ 2% interest) ending in 2006. Steep price, but it saved a country and arguably the world. The terms were remarkably fair to the UK and the sale of 50 destroyers plus other military goods allowed the UK to keep shipping in goods through the U-Boat period. Any equipment the UK kept at the end of the war was sold to them for 10 cents on the dollar. This would not have happened without FDR (who could have said no). I believe the government and people of the UK did benefit from American generosity, but they did not get a free ride.

Now they still owe the US for WW I though... :helpsmily:

Many people forget about the Marshall Plan where 13 Billion was given to Germany to re-build their economy and transformed it from rubble to a world economy.

Full Lend Lease Terms here...

Marshall Plan

I was thinking about the earlier story. It gives the lie to those who thought Britain and Europe were the beneficiaries of American largesse during WWII and should be grateful for what they got. I'm not saying there isn't some truth to that, but clearly we were paying just a little for the help!


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