34 replies to this topic

[shadragon]

Thinking of getting into tech diving? Here is a basic intro article for you to read.

Perhaps those "in the know" can comment on its validity.

[diverdeb]

Very valid points and reasons to consider going the technical route. I especially like the "you aren't as good as you think you are part." Overconfidence has not place in diving - recreational or technical.

[PerroneFord]

Comment on it's validity...

I have either personally known, or been acquainted with someone who has died from not following each lesson (singly or in combination) on that list. Technical diving is not a game that forgives. Learn from the lessons of the past or proceed at your own peril. I have not done much diving in the past year and a half. Thus I am back to OW diving only. And most of that in water less than 40ft. Yes I am deco trained, cave trained, and have done both with some skill. But as the article stated, it's an issue of mileage. I've turned down numerous offers to cave dive in the past year because I know I am nowhere CLOSE to where I should be for that level of diving.

Very good article.

[Diverbrian]

I agree with most of it. I am waiting for things to improve financially before I get back into "more serious" tech diving. I have a quarry that allows for some decompression work so that I can stay relatively sharp. Still, I need more boat time before diving some of the deeper stuff that I used to dive.

One of the major points that I agree with is the concept that if you pursue this type of diving, you need to dive, dive, and dive some more to stay sharp. If you can't commit that time and money into diving, then you shouldn't be doing dives that can go so catastrophically wrong.

Also, I agree with the part that says that nobody is as good as they think that they are. Arrogance kills in diving. That isn't just in "technical" diving either. I have seen people get into trouble doing wall dives in the Turks and Caicos or doing relatively easy dives in the St. Lawrence Seaway (Brockville) simply because they overestimated what they could do. That is why any type of diving has emergency procedures to get someone out before the real trouble starts.

Diving is a very safe sport, but one needs to check their ego at the boat dock.

[Dave L]

I thought it was excellent advice for just about any level or activity of diving. Great article. Will reread it occasionally to keep myself focused. Thanks for the link.

Dave

[Jerrymxz]

I'm going to resurrect this thread because in the Truk PM there was question about Tec training. I thought it prudent to bring this out in open and not clog up that thread by running it off topic.

The question was (paraphrased) whether to do advanced Nitrox and Deco together or separately.

He is my opinion on the subject.

Short answer is separately,
You are going from a single al80 and single first stage with a couple seconds mounted in a recreational bc.

In Advanced Nitrox you add an al30 or 40 with a high O2 gas and a gas change. In addition you learn how to throw a bag, you add an H valve with 2 first and a 7 foot primary hose. and practice Deco stops. Take my word for it. That's a lot of new gear and skills to master to earn your advanced Nitrox.

Then in Deco it's doubles with an isolation manifold, a backplate and wing, gas planning, team coordination, performing Deco stops as a team. Creating a run schedule that you must follow to the second. Lead your team through Deco stops when your buddy has no mask. Then your buddy does it while you have no mask. Did I mention your on a real Deco required dive?
You must demonstrate the ability to hold a set depth in blue water for 5 min with no line or other visual reference within +or- one foot.

What do the rest you think?

[Scubatooth]

I will second Jerry's comments... Practice, Practice, Practice and when you think you got it down practice some more. In Tech diving 2 is 1 and 1 is none. Things need to be second nature (muscle memory - don, doff, ditching) that you can find and retrieve without looking. Same goes for emergency procedures.

If you have never dove doubles before I suggest you practice before even entering a class as it is totally different feeling and balance in the water. Depending on your set up they may roll you to one side as well as either head or butt heavy. Then you have more gear (reels, spools, markers/bags, slates, lines cutters, knifes, shears, wet notes, john line, extra clips (bolt snaps or double-enders),extra mask etc) that is either clipped off or in thigh pockets.


Now if you dive side-mount with two tanks the balance is straight forward. Its when you have an odd number of cylinders that you have to adjust your weights so you trim out evenly. also having more then one tank on one side(bottom gas with a deco) you have to plan the set up of the rigging and how they will clip in. That rigging could also lead you to have to change the length or routing of your regs.

For example I have been out of the water for a very long time and just now just getting back in the water. I'm holding off on adding any gear to my set up till I can do the skills (shooting a bag, holding stops/trim) at the level I need to for tech diving. I tried jumping in back into things with bottom gas tanks + deco and it didn't end well, so back to base set up and will rebuild from there.

my 2 psi.

[Jerrymxz]

Did I mention I didn't earn my Deco certification the first time. Needed several additional dive to demonstrate the necessary skills to satisfy the requirements. In addition to several trips to the local quarry to practice skills.

[Scubatooth]

Same here, After my Deco class in Bonaire, I made the trip to Lake Jocassee and completed the requirements. Wasnt perfect dive but an improvement and the instructor was satisfied.

Also found out how much more Nitrogen Narcosis effects me in 40f deg then it did in 86F deg water.

Practice till it muscle memory and practice again.

A difference from recreational to technical. In recreational diving if you paid the fee you get the certification, however in the technical realm you pay for the training and the instructors time... you have to earn the certification.

[VADiver]

Just to add to the practice part....there are classes you can take to introduce you to doubles. It's a whole different way to dive so quality instruction is key. It's not about the cert, it's about learning the proper procedures. If you want to get into this type of diving research quality instructors and talk out your future progression with them...they'll help you out with gear selection and getting you squared away.

[georoc01]

Yeah, I remember the first time we dove with 4 tanks, 2 on my back, an al 80 on my right and an al 40 on my left. Talk about balance issues. Then we had to be able to drop the tanks and pick them up while maintaining your buoyancy.

After getting all of that training, going back to a single AL 80 on my back became much, much easier.

[Lephenix]

Hi,

I did about 50 recreational dives with double steel 112 and did my PADI deep & wreck divers certification. Then did NACD cavern diver certification with double aluminium 80. Then did DSAT/PADI tech deep diver certification with double steel 112, alu 80 stage & alu stage 40 & argon bottle & canister light in St-Lawrence seaway; probably the toughest training I did in my life. Then went back to recreational diving with a single tank (my back thank me for this). Basically the whole gear configuration thing was hammered into me from the beginning. What is more challenging is to combine the task loading exercices with situational and buddy awareness. Also the team has to move together.


If you want to use your tech or cave skills, do it on the Truk Odyssey. The set up seems really perfect for this. No trucks/no cars, a single stage, lighter alu 80s, wet suit. Easy tech diving. This allows you to focus on buddy skills and enjoying the dive.


If you don't have the skills and equipment, get them at home and train in a quarry.


Personnally, I think the best training you can get is Full Cave diver certification. This one I have to do. The tech deep diver cert. is more about managing gas supply and gear. The cave cert. is about pure dive skills (like perfect buoyancy control and fining techniques).


Lephenix

[Jay]

Just to add to the practice part....there are classes you can take to introduce you to doubles. It's a whole different way to dive so quality instruction is key. It's not about the cert, it's about learning the proper procedures. If you want to get into this type of diving research quality instructors and talk out your future progression with them...they'll help you out with gear selection and getting you squared away.

+1 to this.

Quality instruction is a key factor. Practice, practice. Buoyancy control, trim, holding stops, proficiency in propulsion technique, are practiced on every dive. Always important and critical when technical diving as depths increase, deco obligations increase, overheads, increased gear configs etc...

Todays fun DPV run at 100fsw will include someone going OOG on the fly or some problem solving drill amongst the 4 of us. All great fun that sharpens muscle memory and situational awareness.
IMO, the recreational diver that embraces the skill aspects of technical diving will enjoy diving far more through increased skills and ability. You may never choose to exceed 60fsw, but when you have great command of the basics, diving is a riot.

[Jerrymxz]

Let me re-ask my original question.

Do you recommend to someone who has 100 or more dives, has AOW, RESCUE and several specially certs, to do advanced Nitrox in conjunction with Decompression procedures. I think from the previous replies I know the answer.

I would like to prevent people from making the same mistakes I did.

[Lephenix]

Hello Jerry,

I think it all depends on preparation, physical and mental abilities. You have to be fit and do extensive research on your subject. It is tough: do 2 decompression dives, haul heavy gear, have dinner, go back to the hotel room, do the exams, go to bed late, do more dives the day after. It's better if you already know your tech gear, your dry suit, your O2 analyser, etc. If you are good, the instructor will push you to your limits, so you know it is going to be painful.

My answer would be no, wait.

Lephenix