15 replies to this topic

[JulioJoglar]

For the most part, diving is a safe sport. However, accidents do occur and when they do, we like to learn and find out the cause of the accident. For two New Zealand divers, however, the cause of their accident was evident to their doctor right away; they were "dumb".

A New Zeland Doctor at the recompression chamber where two novice divers were treated after getting the bends, concluded that the fate of this two divers was caused by them not keeping a close eye on their air supply. The doctor's conclusion, with a small scientific margin of error, was swift and to the point; they were "dumb". Ouch...

http://www.nzherald....section=general

[mvillanueva]

For the most part, diving is a safe sport.  However, accidents do occur and when they do, we like to learn and find out the cause of the accident.  For two New Zealand divers, however, the cause of their accident was evident to their doctor right away; they were "dumb".

A New Zeland Doctor at the recompression chamber where two novice divers were treated after getting the bends, concluded that the fate of this two divers was caused by them not keeping a close eye on their air supply.  The doctor's conclusion, with a small scientific margin of error, was swift and to the point; they were "dumb".  Ouch...

http://www.nzherald....section=general

Ummm...

And the first paragraph in your post's purpose was to.....???

ne'er mind....


Thanks for the info Julio! I appreciate it.

[triggerfish]

not to mate with the divers in question so as not to perpetuate the dumb gene?

[RichardB]

not to mate with the divers in question so as not to perpetuate the dumb gene?

Well, exceptions to this rule are made if they look like THIS

[drbill]

I'd certainly "lower" my standards to mate with something like that as long as mate refers to "pair off" rather than successful reproduction!

Doc

[RichardB]

I'd certainly "lower" my standards to mate with something like that as long as mate refers to "pair off" rather than successful reproduction!

Doc

Excellent point and very well defined.

[mvillanueva]

The doctor's conclusion, with a small scientific margin of error, was swift and to the point; they were "dumb".

http://www.nzherald....section=general

Sounds like they were maybe inexperienced?

Dumb seems like the wrong word to use....

I really wish these stories were less telegraphic -- so much is left to conjecture and inuendo.

[JulioJoglar]

Sorry MV. Anything more than a "telegraphic" narration may get me in copyright violation issues.

[RichardB]

I'm with Julio and the Doc. Inexperience is not knowing the juice is on, dumb is knowing and sticking your tongue in the outlet anyway.

[mvillanueva]

Sorry MV.  Anything more than a "telegraphic" narration may get me in copyright violation issues.

I meant the story itself in the link is telegraphic -- maybe I am the one that just does not have enough experience to get all the nuances.


The good crusty salt doctor saying they were " "dumb" not to keep a close eye on their air supply as they dived" tells me nothing. Did one, or both, have a panic attack underwater? Was the current strong? Either physiological exertion in the case of a current or psychological exertion in the case of a panic attack or high anxiety (to quote Mel Brooks) can blow through your air supply.

Crusty goes on to note that both men were "probably breathing very quickly..." What caused that type of breathing? Think about it: One's breathing pattern does NOT up and change for no apparent reason. Breathing patterns (aside from volition) change either (a) to meet physiological need or (b) pyschological need. Something happened to increase heart rate and thus breathing rate.

I can see the exchange now: "Hey Frank, why the hell don't we just here start breathing real fast for the heck of it?" "Day-um!! Sounds like a plan to me! You huff first!.

A world of possibilities get crammed into a sorta of a Procrustean Diving Bed by using the word "dumb".

My beef was not with what you wrote, rather, my beef was with the brevity of the article and the good "dumb" doctor.

but hey ... what do I know? I have no experience to really speak of.

Guess I am feeling crusty.

Michael

Edited by mvillanueva, 25 August 2004 - 10:46 PM.

[JulioJoglar]

Hey MV, maybe there was nothing more than two divers not keeping an eye on their air supply. As Freud said once, sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.

[triggerfish]

[quote name='RichardB' date='Aug 25 2004, 07:48 PM'] !

Doc [/QUOTE]
Excellent point and very well defined.

[/quote]
as were her cheeks.

[SquattingRadishDM]

I find it really annoying when news reports like this give you so little information, such as certification level. However I think based on the little info we have got dumb is an understatement.

One guy runs out of air, shares air with his buddy at 25m. When this happened I take it the guy with air didn't look at his guage as they both only ascended 10m to 15m before running out. They didnt judge their ascent rate based on what was left in the tank.

You would have thought the guy with the air might have thought "Bobs run out of air. I wonder how much air I have? I havnt checked in a while".

They could have made a rapid ascent to 5m/15ft then had a few breaths at 0.5 atmospheres to off-gas then maybe they wouldn't have had DCI as bad. Any thoughts on how else to handle a situation like this (yeah I know we all watch our air supplies and this would NEVER happen to us, but this is hypothetical)

-Jack

[Trymixdiver]

Dumb would have been continuing the dive at 15m while buddy breathing. These guys are stupid based on what we have to go on.

Then again there could a story here we dont know, lets hope so anyway

Andy

[mvillanueva]

Hey MV, maybe there was nothing more than two divers not keeping an eye on their air supply. As Freud said once, sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.

A cigar is just a cigar?

Maybe.

But Havanna or Panama, every cigar has an origin.