37 replies to this topic

[Diverbrian]

Assuming that the people reading this will be diving with a good SD.com buddy on this board, I am starting an exercise.

There may be some completely wrong answers and I will learn them with everybody else if I don't know them. Walter and a few of the instructors will quickly correct us, I am sure. I would expect SD.com divers to be THINKING divers, even on vacation.

There will be NO COMPLETELY pretty answers to the scenarios if I list them right. For the Trekkies, think of this as the test that they discuss in the second Star Trek movie that the Captain cheated on:

What would you do?

You are on a trip to Cozumel. You are a couple of days into the SD trip. You have found a dive buddy that you seem to "gravitate to" and the feeling seems to be mutual. HINT: They are of the opposite sex.

Well, the night before this dive, your DB has some family issues back home and has insomnia. They get maybe an hour's sleep. You aren't quite sure. They are irratible on the boat. This will be an eighty ft. dive.

What do you do and why? Like the former NP (now Giant Kelpfish), I will keep my opinion to myself for now. I would like us all to see how our future dive buddies would respond and why.

[hnladue]

I would probably dive with them to help them get their minds off their troubles, but I wouldn't go down to 80ft. Maybe 30 or 40 and just hangout... But I would stick to them like glue!

Or I could just say Screw 'Em, make them stay on the boat and sleep, and go dive with the hottie!!

But I'm not like that so I would probably try to help them out. Even stay behind if needed.

[Dejah]

I personally would suggest that they not dive at all and calm down first and get some rest, the result of possibly diving to 80' in that condition could possibly be a horriable situation and the result could be hanging around the hospital for a few days afterwards.

I think as far as the hottie was concerned, me personally would be more concerned with my friend/buddy than with someone who I spotted of the opposite sex, however once things were under control with my friend/buddy and I knew they were going to be safe then who knows...

[drbill]

I would hope they would recognize if they were not in the right condition to dive. I would ask a few questions to give them an opening... something to the effect of "you look tired, are you sure you're up for the deep dive today?" Perhaps softened with something like "I've really enjoyed diving with you as my buddy and I was just concerned."

My "regular" buddies (I dive solo 80% of the time) have aborted dives for various reasons including lack of sleep, cramps, etc. No problem there as they felt comfortable communicating that to me and knew I would continue my diving (unless they needed help). With a new dive buddy, that comfort level may not be there and you may have to coax them a bit to get them to recognize their condition.

Dr. B.

[Marvel]

Assuming that the people reading this will be diving with a good SD.com buddy on this board, I am starting an exercise.

There may be some completely wrong answers and I will learn them with everybody else if I don't know them. Walter and a few of the instructors will quickly correct us, I am sure. I would expect SD.com divers to be THINKING divers, even on vacation.

There will be NO COMPLETELY pretty answers to the scenarios if I list them right. For the Trekkies, think of this as the test that they discuss in the second Star Trek movie that the Captain cheated on:

What would you do?

You are on a trip to Cozumel. You are a couple of days into the SD trip. You have found a dive buddy that you seem to "gravitate to" and the feeling seems to be mutual. HINT: They are of the opposite sex.

Well, the night before this dive, your DB has some family issues back home and has insomnia. They get maybe an hour's sleep. You aren't quite sure. They are irratible on the boat. This will be an eighty ft. dive.

What do you do and why? Like the former NP (now Giant Kelpfish), I will keep my opinion to myself for now. I would like us all to see how our future dive buddies would respond and why.

Hmmm- sticky situation, alright! Do you attempt to call the dive? If so, I think you would be obligated to offer to stay behind as well & that's no fun, especially if you have paid big money to go on the trip. And, what happens if they refuse? Do you then notify the divemaster, risking a lot of fallout, or do you give in & try to keep an eagle eye out for problems? Certainly, this is a question better answered by our more experienced members. I'm just trying to consider the human factors of a budding (or even existing) relationship into the question.

[Diverbrian]

My mistake. The DB in question IS the hottie that you met two days ago. Remember, we fly in from around the country/world on these trips. I do like the twists on the tale from the ladies interpretation, though .

[fbp]

Hmm... Well, not too concerned about the 1 hour sleep as most of us know sitting in airports, when the sun rises or activities get going, the lack of sleep within a 24-hour period, I don't consider a problem. Usually they get a second wind. Obviously 'not' if drinking all night etc...

Acting irritable, the dive would probably kewl the DB down, take their mind off as 'Hnladue' mentioned.

I'd watch closely how the DB gets ready, attends to the gear, would ask if there's a problem and how they're feeling right then and blankly ask if "They" feel ok about diving.. ' Depending upon my observations, The DB diving experience, my feelings on what it is happening AND most important the DIVE PROFILE I'd probably still go comfortably.

Diving to 80' in Coz is not the same as diving 80' in bad vis, open ocean, strong currents with just the two of us after a night of drinking (not that we would). The dive profile would have to be a "mellow" dive and might even stay around the dive master as a back up.. (yes I know the depth is the same etc...)

Bottom line,
- little sleep the night before? = not a problem
- things on the mind = not a problem
- irritating? heheh aren't we all = not a problem


Now having said that, add the following and it is a problem:
- strong currents, chance of getting separated = problem
- hungover due to the usually problem solving techniques = problem
- despondent on prepping gear = maybe a problem
- Diving experience = strong consideration

and I'd probably stay a little closer and watchful than normal and would try to get them to laugh underwater by doing funny things. heheh... whatever that is...

ps. I have no problem calling a dive or sitting one out if my dive buddy wants to sit it out.. just figure "I'll have to come back again..." to do the dive.. a good excuse. I typically call dives, for moi anyway, if it's too much of a hassel. As noted above, it's just not worth the hassel of major problems and ruining a trip for one dive isn't worth it..

Edited by fbp, 28 April 2004 - 09:41 AM.

[Laura]

DB,

I wouldn't dive with them, and I would encourage them not to dive either. If they are fatigued, distracted, and upset, before they even start the dive, that's too many risk factors for me. Also, they would be more likey to get narc'd at 80 feet, and (although it might help their bad mood) it's too risky, IMHO.

So, I'd give them a nice backrub to calm them down and lull them to sleep, then I would either dive with someone else, or take an "hour of power" (nap) too. The ocean will still be there when they wake up.

As scarlett o'hara says...tomorrow is another day.

Laura

Edited by Laura, 28 April 2004 - 10:11 AM.

[DandyDon]

Yeah, I thought you meant that the Dive-Bud and the Hottie-of-Interest were the same person, although I stumbled over your use of the pronoun "They," but I got confused when the first repliers treated this as a triangle...?

Okay, She is the DB, HoI, the person who got little sleep and is distressed, all in one...?

I'll go with FBP pretty much here. I might ask her if she felt up to diving, and give her an easy out possibility. If the dive doesn't look very challenging, I wouldn't want to talk her out of diving and miss that therapy. I might double check her gear set up more closely, I would plan on watching her more closely, and I might even ask the Dive Guide to help watch her. Hey, good time to hold hands for the dive...!!

What if she didn't feel like diving? No question here, for me: "See ya' later, then. I'll tell ya' about it." But that's me; I just don't put any work into my interest of women these days, and I am certainly there to dive. I'd try to hook up with her later, but if she was so fickle as to hook up with another guy while I was gone, I'd call that minimizing losses.

I have a different challenge with my Home-Bud JER: If it's just him and me, we're fine. I'm still playing mentor as he learns from experience, mistake, etc. but he's a dependable buddy - unless we add a woman to the picture?! Then it becomes the Three Musketeers to a degree, but mostly JER following the woman, and me buddying with my pony bottle.

[fbp]

I just don't put any work into my interest of women these days, and I am certainly there to dive. I'd try to hook up with her later, but if she was so fickle as to hook up with another guy while I was gone, I'd call that minimizing losses.

LOL DD... heheh... can certainly relate to that..

It sounds like a typical scenario in that if I stayed with her to "cheer her up" (if I could), chances are she'd jump at they next diver that came up and spend the rest of the day asking about the dive..
heheh.. so I hear ya Man...

Focus on what you came to do.. anything above that will happen or not, but trying to show consideration and sympathy seems to be out these days...
ASD?? (Attention Span Deficit) I dunno...

So, like you, hit the water with a pony and plan for the worst, hope for the best..

[maxdvr]

thats easy for me.....call the dive.....the last thing i need is a buddy with rented grey matter....it reminds me of the diver who drown in gilboa quarry last summer.....granted ..it was during a class....but in every class i've ever takin ....i had a buddy....some i had just met.....my evaluation of that persons attention to detail determines if im willing to risk my life with someone who isnt willing to risk theirs for me....if they have other thing on their mind...i.e. family probs....hangover...sex with the hottie....keep that ashore...just one divers opinion...but hey...thats all i am...just one diver

[Coo's Toe]

Depends on a lot of factors, Brian. The biggest being, how experianced a diver is she/he. If this is their first real dive trip after recently being certified, or if they've been out of the water for 6 months... then I might be trying to gently coax them into calling the dive. But if they were an experianced diver, then I'll trust that like me, they are in tune with their abilities and comfort level enough to call the dive or proceed as appropriate.

I have been diving before after just an hour or so of sleep. Yes, I got good and narced past 80 feet. Was I a danger to my buddy? No, I gave the sign to head up and level off, and all was well. In fact, nothing wakes you up quite like jumping into water does.

I don't think it's right to view buddy relationships as a babysitting situation. I am watchful and mindful, but I leave it up to my buddy to establish their level of comfort and readiness for the dive. Hopefully no one will ever try to second guess my decisions if I say I am ready to go diving.

[Laura]

thats easy for me.....call the dive.....the last thing i need is a buddy with rented grey matter....it reminds me of the diver who drown in gilboa quarry last summer.....granted ..it was during a class....but in every class i've ever takin ....i had a buddy....some i had just met.....my evaluation of that persons attention to detail determines if im willing to risk my life with someone who isnt willing to risk theirs for me....if they have other thing on their mind...i.e. family probs....hangover...sex with the hottie....keep that ashore...just one divers opinion...but hey...thats all i am...just one diver

I think some divers under-estimate the dificulty if Gilboa, especially the deep side. It's dark and deep and cold.

And I agree about not diving with rented grey matter! Nicely put

Laura

[jextract]

Excellent scenario! I always have the cardinal agreement with anyone I dive with well ahead of time: "any diver can call any dive for any (or no) reason without getting any grief."

With this as a pre-requisite, I think I would encourage her to ride out on the boat and continue to make my assessment on the way out. The fresh air and change of scenery might help, but you can bet I'm watching her attention to detail on the gear-up. Assuming in my estimation she's not a danger to herself or to me, I think I'd still dive with her but let her lead the two of us so that I can keep my eye on her the whole time (not that I think this would be a great hardship under the best of circumstances, given the assumption in the stated problem). This also frees her to go where she wants without having to stress too much about following me. Could be just the ticket to get her out of her funk. HOWEVER, at the first sign that this ain't goin' well, I'm calling the dive.

[kevininpo]

Depends on a lot of factors, Brian. The biggest being, how experianced a diver is she/he. If this is their first real dive trip after recently being certified, or if they've been out of the water for 6 months... then I might be trying to gently coax them into calling the dive. But if they were an experianced diver, then I'll trust that like me, they are in tune with their abilities and comfort level enough to call the dive or proceed as appropriate.

I have been diving before after just an hour or so of sleep. Yes, I got good and narced past 80 feet. Was I a danger to my buddy? No, I gave the sign to head up and level off, and all was well. In fact, nothing wakes you up quite like jumping into water does.

I don't think it's right to view buddy relationships as a babysitting situation. I am watchful and mindful, but I leave it up to my buddy to establish their level of comfort and readiness for the dive. Hopefully no one will ever try to second guess my decisions if I say I am ready to go diving.

Wa divers are just too smart for their own good...l TOTALLY agree with Coo on this :lam: