7 replies to this topic

[PerroneFord]

More Truth in this than you might imagine...

Likewise, when we have an unfortunate death in the Cave community, we want to know as much as possible, in order to know if Protocols were violated, or just Diver(Pilot) error.

Post Mortem downloads of computers can, and DO, give many insights.

Norm

Norm,

I wasn't joking. You and I don't live far apart (~2hours) and I suspect we'll see each other around. I too am thinking of taking classes with Larry Green. Probably Intro and Cave. I think I am going to take Cavern locally with a friend of mine.

Any opinions on taking my courses with Larry vs. Jim Wyatt? Both seem excellent instructors. I am aware of Larry's position in the NACD right now. And it would probably be cool to train at Eagles Nest!

I'll be down at the NACD convention. Maybe I'll see you.



Note: This was split out from the dive computer thread in General Diving to give this topic the great attention that it deserves.

Your friendly, SD moderators

[normblitch]

More Truth in this than you might imagine...

Likewise, when we have an unfortunate death in the Cave community, we want to know as much as possible, in order to know if Protocols were violated, or just Diver(Pilot) error.

Post Mortem downloads of computers can, and DO, give many insights.

Norm

Norm,

I wasn't joking. You and I don't live far apart (~2hours) and I suspect we'll see each other around. I too am thinking of taking classes with Larry Green. Probably Intro and Cave. I think I am going to take Cavern locally with a friend of mine.

Any opinions on taking my courses with Larry vs. Jim Wyatt? Both seem excellent instructors. I am aware of Larry's position in the NACD right now. And it would probably be cool to train at Eagles Nest!

I'll be down at the NACD convention. Maybe I'll see you.

I don't know JW, so I can't make any comparison...strokes & Folks! He HAS been in the Game for quite a while. Johnny Richards is another fine Instructor (AND is fromTexas )

I WOULD strongly suggest that you do the Cavern cert with the same Instructor as you will for Intro...reason being, of ALL the skill sets you will be exposed to in the Cavern/Intro/Apprentice/Full syllabus, the MOST (AND the most Important) will come during Cavern. OK, in true, Apprentice will add manifold valve management & Deco, BUT in all, IMHO Cavern sets the table for all the other courses (ouch, pun)...(Hopefully I won't get Flamed here)...I first re-certed Cavern thru a name-less "Mainstream Rec Agency", and within 4 months took it AGAIN from LG...first off the "Big Name" course was, frankly, fluff...WORSE, most leading-edgeTech certifiers (NSS, NACD, TDI, etc) will NOT accept these Cavern cards.

Overhead training will force you to put MORE trust in your Instructor than ever before...pick wisely, and stick with him...they DO become your Mentor, available by email or FTF chats Springside...

I don't know if I have PM yet, but if you want, I can speak more at length via pm as soon as I upgrade.

Norm

[TraceMalin]

Overhead training will force you to put MORE trust in your Instructor than ever before...pick wisely, and stick with him...they DO become your Mentor

Norm

I'll flame you here, Norm. for fun. You won't see too much of that on SD. I think what you mean is that you have to choose wisely about who your instructor and what program and agency you follow because you really are training "on Everest" for Everest so to speak. As we know, the instructor makes the difference and not the agency. But, as an inexperienced cave diver, you are more vulnerable to being instructor dependent than in open water. Instructor dependency is never a good idea. I try to break my students of that on day one of their training and my cave instructor, Chris Wright, did that to me. He won't let me trust or rely on him for anything and every decision that I make comes down to me. In fact, he usually is the one TRYING to screw me up.

Trace

[PerroneFord]

Norm, I hear ya. The guy I would be taking cavern from is NACD #I-151 and is the current Treasurer and Journal Editor for NACD. I have every confidence in his ability. And have known him persoanally for over 15 years. I have no intent of doing "fluff" courses for technical training. All my courses from here forward are IANTD, GUE, or NACD. Though I might have to do a NAUI AOW.

There is a HUGE benefit to living in N.FL. if you want to pursue technical divng.

[normblitch]

Overhead training will force you to put MORE trust in your Instructor than ever before...pick wisely, and stick with him...they DO become your Mentor

Norm

I'll flame you here, Norm. for fun. You won't see too much of that on SD. I think what you mean is that you have to choose wisely about who your instructor and what program and agency you follow because you really are training "on Everest" for Everest so to speak. As we know, the instructor makes the difference and not the agency. But, as an inexperienced cave diver, you are more vulnerable to being instructor dependent than in open water. Instructor dependency is never a good idea. I try to break my students of that on day one of their training and my cave instructor, Chris Wright, did that to me. He won't let me trust or rely on him for anything and every decision that I make comes down to me. In fact, he usually is the one TRYING to screw me up.

Trace

Trace,

(so you mean this ISN'T DecoStop? That is why I stick to CDF...the flame heat WAY lower)

Point well put.

The Instructor is there to let you "Find the Truth" yourself, or as a Team...LG's nickname is "The Phantom"...he had been gigging me about a sagging battery cannister, and during the lights-out, on-the-line, touch-contact drill, deftly reached down, and double-looped the line around the latch. Point Made. OTOH, my SAC rate on that drill was among my LOWEST!

Zen. Go figure...

Norm

[normblitch]

Norm, I hear ya.  The guy I would be taking cavern from is NACD #I-151 and is the current Treasurer and Journal Editor for NACD.  I have every confidence in his ability.  And have known him persoanally for over 15 years.  I have no intent of doing "fluff" courses for technical training.  All my courses from here forward are IANTD, GUE, or NACD.  Though I might have to do a NAUI AOW.

There is a HUGE benefit to living in N.FL. if you want to pursue technical divng.

Booked him (you KNEW I would...)

From all I've heard, HE is also on that short list...knowing him before will just be iceing on the Cake...

Bravo!

Norm

[cmt489]

(Hopefully I won't get Flamed here)...I

Yup - Trace is right! We try to enforce a play nice policy here and encourage people to be friends, not enemies. Debate is fine but flames and insults are not tolerated here. Part of the reason I love this board so much. Hopefully you will too!

[PerroneFord]

Booked him (you KNEW I would...)

From all I've heard, HE is also on that short list...knowing him before will just be iceing on the Cake...

Bravo!

Norm

Yea, I knew you would! That's why I gave the particulars. I knew Jeff before he was certified. In fact, I was certified before he was! Obviously, he's done a lot more with his than me!

I'e known many to take his training and be very pleased. I emailed him a few months ago and told him I'd be doing my cavern cert with him. Great guy. I'd do all the course with him if he wasn't "in town". I really want to get away from work, and my other distractions when I start taking cave courses. I just want to focus on learning. I won't even take my phone or laptop for those trips.