Rescue Class
#1
Posted 25 September 2005 - 10:01 AM
I believe YES.
What do you believe? Even if its wrong.
#2
Posted 25 September 2005 - 10:05 AM
Better navigation, buoyancy control and drills in safety procedures should be manadory.
Edited by Fairybasslet, 25 September 2005 - 10:06 AM.
#3
Posted 25 September 2005 - 10:20 AM
But since that makes us less than 5% of the diving public, lets focus on the dropped weight belt bubble hits or air embolisims
the tank on foot syndrom
heat or cold exposure things that everybody comes in contact with.
For now lets leave out cave exploration and wreck penetration deaths.
#4
Posted 25 September 2005 - 10:24 AM
Most of the accidents and deaths I see (and they are all too regular for my taste) are newly certified (or being certified) divers or those who have not dived in a long time and return to the water without refreshing their skills.
#5
Posted 25 September 2005 - 10:36 AM
....well, I think it will be a cold day in 'the hot place' before the dive industry sanctions your approach..........it isn't considered politically-correct to mention the possibilty of accidents in scuba-diving...it's bad for sales.Since most dive accidents happen to OW and AOW students, shouldn't the rescue class be taught as part of and just after the OW instruction before they can get their C Card?
I believe YES.
What do you believe? Even if its wrong.
.......for what it's worth, my impression is that the bulk of diving accidents involve brand-new or very-inexperienced divers.......or the 'couch-potatoe' , older , one-dive-trip-a-year crowd.
#6
Posted 25 September 2005 - 10:41 AM
But I will say this. I think training should go back to what it was in the olden days when Dr. Bill started out.
#7
Posted 25 September 2005 - 10:48 AM
I think at one time it was (see bill's post). I don't even think the AOW should be split from OW. OW, AOW, and Rescue should be all one cert.Since most dive accidents happen to OW and AOW students, shouldn't the rescue class be taught as part of and just after the OW instruction before they can get their C Card?
I believe YES.
What do you believe? Even if its wrong.
"A good marriage is like an interlocking neurosis, where the rocks in one person's head fill up the holes in the other's."
#8
Posted 25 September 2005 - 11:49 AM
1 massive certifying course - that makes the student have some skin in the game to actually learn the information they were being fed. Not just regurgeitate it hours after being spoon fed.
Edited by Trimix2dive, 25 September 2005 - 11:51 AM.
#9
Posted 25 September 2005 - 12:08 PM
But how many people would stick with something that long? I think that divers are given some choices right now...and they usually choose price or timing issues. It's only those of us who are now certified that realize how much we don't know and wish we could of had more training. However how many would have actually stuck with a class that long? I know I would not have however I have certainly gone back for more training at every opportunity that I can now.Thats the direction I was headed with this thread Brinybay. It could be called the five atmospheres scuba diving training course - all 3 wrapped together.
1 massive certifying course - that makes the student have some skin in the game to actually learn the information they were being fed. Not just regurgeitate it hours after being spoon fed.
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#10
Posted 25 September 2005 - 12:18 PM
KC
#11
Posted 25 September 2005 - 12:56 PM
According to the Annual Report on Decompression Illness, Diving Fatalities and Project Dive Exploration, the largest sector of accidents in diving actually occurs to divers holding advanced diving certifications. For deaths, it is slightly higher for advanced compared to entry level divers. The overwhelming majority of accidents and deaths occurred with males as compared with females (this goes well beyond consideration of the number of each sex of diver in the general popluation). You can see all of the statistics by going to www.DiversAlertNetwork.org, however, you must be a member to see the actual reports.
I have a theory on this: Divers who have a fair number of dives under their proverbial dive belts tend to have advanced certifications. However, having that certification, they do not continue their dive education, they do not dive frequently, they do not remain sharp in their skills, they do not practice their skills, and they become complacent about their diving habits, giving them a false sense of security that puts them into situations where accidents and deaths occur. Throw in a little male macho ego, and some or all of these combinations lead to a higher number of injuries and deaths. Again, this is just my personal observation; I do not have conclusive proof of my beliefs.
Some agencies, such as NAUI, require fairly in-depth rescue techniques to be taught at all levels of certification (a resort course is not certification). Even in skin diving classes for children, students must bring a submerged unconscious diver to the surface, and tow the diver while performing ventilations.
My ideal entry level class is to teach Skin Diver, Scuba Diver, Advanced Diver and Rescue Diver as one academy of learning. Additionally, students would take DAN, CPR and first aid training concurrently. As John Lennon once said: "You might say I'm a dreamer. But, I'm not the only one."
Wenchie brings out an excellent real world point in that, until we have the experience, one does not realize what we need in the form of "adequate" initial training before having sufficient experience to go out and use our license to learn on our own in the real world. It is pretty much impossible to explain this to one that has not yet had the experience. So, many people do not want to invest the time and money into this training.
Only if all agencies required this as a minimum would people become willing to invest what it takes for a proper start. Good luck on waiting for that day to come!
"For the diligent diver, closed circuit rebreathers are actually safer than open circuit scuba." Tom Mount
#12
Posted 25 September 2005 - 01:20 PM
I think your theory is 100% valid.... one of the reasons I try to keep a little sharper and continue to renew my respect for the water... As a beginning OW, I know that I exceeded my skill level on a few occasions... even got rolled around in the surf once in some waves and busted up my new camera setup - fortunately a cheap one (I think I had about 40 dives by then and may have been just a little overconfident)... definitely gained a healthy respect for the ocean. It increased my skill level considerably as a matter of necessity, but trial by fire may not be the best approach for people to take.I have a theory on this: Divers who have a fair number of dives under their proverbial dive belts tend to have advanced certifications. However, having that certification, they do not continue their dive education, ..... etc...
(Read the post above)
My point with the resort course (which I realize is only good at the resort and chaparoned) was that the possible dangers aren't even hardly mentioned... And as WW says, we don't even realize ourselves until we get involved with diving how much we DON'T know.
KC
#13
Posted 25 September 2005 - 01:50 PM
And when we all focus on how to become a better diver rather than 'who's agency is better', the diver can make a more informed decision...even as a newbie! Now that is what its all about! -ww
Contact me directly at Kamala@SingleDivers.com for your private or group travel needs or 864-557-6079 AND don't miss SD's 2018-2021 Trips! ....here! Most are once in a lifetime opportunities...don't miss the chance to go!!
SD LEGACY/OLD/MANUAL Forms & Documents.... here !
Click here TO PAY for Merchandise, Membership, or Travel
"Imitation is the sincerest flattery." - Gandhi
"Imitation is proof that originality is rare." - ScubaHawk
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Kamala Shadduck c/o SingleDivers.com LLC
2234 North Federal Hwy, #1010 Boca Raton, FL 33431
formerly...
710 Dive Buddy Lane; Salem, SC 29676
864-557-6079 tel/celfone/office or tollfree fax 888-480-0906
#14
Posted 25 September 2005 - 02:14 PM
I didn't know the American warm water training bodies then, but I know Walter has made posts to the effect that the requirements placed by PADI (for example) have steadily dwindled ever since those days. Sadly BSAC has also dunned down its training in a desperate attempt to regain some of the market it lost in the UK. I say sadly because I do agree with the sentiments expressed here, but today's world is different from the 60's, and people now have more money and less time for activities like scuba diving. We have moved into an instant gratification age, and anyone who tries to buck that trend will simply fail.
#15
Posted 25 September 2005 - 02:22 PM
I made a personal decision a long time ago that I would not teach resort courses. I just don't want to be involved with them at all.My point with the resort course (which I realize is only good at the resort and chaparoned) was that the possible dangers aren't even hardly mentioned... And as WW says, we don't even realize ourselves until we get involved with diving how much we DON'T know.
"For the diligent diver, closed circuit rebreathers are actually safer than open circuit scuba." Tom Mount
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