HELP! I Can't Breathe!
#1
Posted 23 December 2005 - 12:33 PM
Now, to most/some of you, this may not seem like a big deal, but to me... well, I'm looking forward to my impending root canal instead.
I can go into more detail if required but to summarize:
* I am very resistant to holding my breath underwater for any length of time while in motion. Why? I've thought about this but I don't really have an answer.
* I've recently discovered that I breathe *wrong*, therefore I present symptoms on a daily basis of someone who subtly yet chronically hyperventilates. (I'm working with an extremely well-trained and experienced physiotherapist on this.)
* I don't even know what underwater swimming (really) is! How does one position oneself within the water and maintain that position as opposed to swimming on the surface? (I enquired at my pool about private lessons specifically for this but what was told that unless I can do 2 laps (50M) of the front crawl, there's no point in trying to learn underwater swimming.)
Any helpful suggestions would be most appreciated.
#2
Posted 23 December 2005 - 01:01 PM
How do you feel about holding your breath while sticking your head underwater in a bathtub? I wonder if this might be an easy way to start overcoming this concern. Then you could work into doing it in a pool. Simply take a breath and go under for as long as you feel comfortable doing so, then stand up. Keep repeating it to condition yourself to being underwater. Then work into pushing off from the pool's wall in the shallow end and gliding to the other side of the pool, staying over shallow water so you can easily stand if necessary.
I assume you understand that you do not use your arms as much underwater. Most of your propulsion comes from kicking unless you use the breaststroke in which case your arms will come into play.
Yoga might be another way to condition yourself to slowing down your breathing. Although I don't do it, several of my dive buddies and friends do and they say it helps them with their breathing while underwater.
Whatever you do, DON'T try to practice this underwater as you cross the San Pedro Channel to Catalina on Monday. It reaches depths of 3,500 feet!
#3
Posted 23 December 2005 - 01:07 PM
Of course you don't have to swim along the bottom . . .Whatever you do, DON'T try to practice this underwater as you cross the San Pedro Channel to Catalina on Monday. It reaches depths of 3,500 feet!
How does one position oneself within the water and maintain that position as opposed to swimming on the surface?
In a shallow pool, it's not much of a concern, but in deeper water, the deeper you go, the darker and colder it gets, plus you feel more pressure. If you start swimming down at a radical angle, you'll notice.
Every existing thing is born without reason, prolongs itself out of weakness, and dies by chance. - Jean-Paul Sartre
I feel the urge, the urge to submerge! -ScubaHawk - Raptor of the Deep !
WHO DAT!!!!
#4
Posted 23 December 2005 - 01:09 PM
"For the diligent diver, closed circuit rebreathers are actually safer than open circuit scuba." Tom Mount
#5
Posted 23 December 2005 - 01:40 PM
I have swam all of my life, but I cannot swim fast for much of a distance. It is the casual pace of an efficient stroke that allows me to have endurance in the water. I am not sure of your swimming skills, but I would suggest practice not only swimming efficiently, but doing breathe holding exercises at home. Sit on your couch and hold your breathe. Set reasonable goals as to how long you hold your breathe and gradually increase them.
15 meters isn't as far as it sounds, maybe you could even try walking short distances while holding your breathe to help build your confidence. This might help you be more relaxed when you are in the water.
Swimming underwater for any distance requires being calm and relaxed.
Good luck with your training, I hope this helps.
MNJoe
"just your average Joe from Minnesota, also known as Keith"
#6
Posted 23 December 2005 - 02:05 PM
What you can do is to, when you get the urge to breathe, let out about 1/4 of your air. You'll still have enough oxygen to function, but you'll eliminate enough carbon dioxide to get rid of the urge to breathe. You can generally do this a couple of times on one breath.
A fairly common theme to the response that you've received so far is that practice will help. That's true. Also, the more you practice, the more comfortable and relaxed you'll become, which will also improve your performance.
Best of luck,
Rick
Edited by Hipshot, 23 December 2005 - 05:01 PM.
#7
Posted 23 December 2005 - 02:54 PM
I also use the breast stroke when swimming underwater. Make sure your fingers are together and your hands cupped.
Stop trying to cheat, you have to swim 15.24 meters or 50 feet.
DSSW,
WWW™
#8
Posted 23 December 2005 - 03:55 PM
As everyone pretty much knows, my initial foray into the world of SCUBA OW training didn't quite work out. Due to that experience, I'm open to training in a different locale with a different agency. There is a catch, of course ... both of the two agencies that have been suggested to me require a 50 foot (or as we *correctly* say in Canada -- 15M ) underwater swim.
Now, to most/some of you, this may not seem like a big deal, but to me... well, I'm looking forward to my impending root canal instead.
I can go into more detail if required but to summarize:
* I am very resistant to holding my breath underwater for any length of time while in motion. Why? I've thought about this but I don't really have an answer.
* I've recently discovered that I breathe *wrong*, therefore I present symptoms on a daily basis of someone who subtly yet chronically hyperventilates. (I'm working with an extremely well-trained and experienced physiotherapist on this.)
* I don't even know what underwater swimming (really) is! How does one position oneself within the water and maintain that position as opposed to swimming on the surface? (I enquired at my pool about private lessons specifically for this but what was told that unless I can do 2 laps (50M) of the front crawl, there's no point in trying to learn underwater swimming.)
Any helpful suggestions would be most appreciated.
You got very bad advice at your local pool. Either try another pool or another instructor. You definitely need to get in a routine of going to your local pool once a week. Part of that time can be with an instructor but after while it will just be you and the pool.
You apparently just aren't a water person and so everything about it is outside of your comfort level. When you get some help from an understanding instructor who breaks things down into baby steps then your comfort level will increase dramatically. After that you just need to go to the pool and play around and make being in the water fun. By the time you take your scuba class again you will at least be very comfortable in the water.
At this point due to your discomfort in the water you are overthinking things. Trust me
Gray
#9
Posted 23 December 2005 - 04:36 PM
As everyone pretty much knows, my initial foray into the world of SCUBA OW training didn't quite work out. Due to that experience, I'm open to training in a different locale with a different agency. There is a catch, of course ... both of the two agencies that have been suggested to me require a 50 foot (or as we *correctly* say in Canada -- 15M ) underwater swim.
Now, to most/some of you, this may not seem like a big deal, but to me... well, I'm looking forward to my impending root canal instead.
I can go into more detail if required but to summarize:
* I am very resistant to holding my breath underwater for any length of time while in motion. Why? I've thought about this but I don't really have an answer.
* I've recently discovered that I breathe *wrong*, therefore I present symptoms on a daily basis of someone who subtly yet chronically hyperventilates. (I'm working with an extremely well-trained and experienced physiotherapist on this.)
* I don't even know what underwater swimming (really) is! How does one position oneself within the water and maintain that position as opposed to swimming on the surface? (I enquired at my pool about private lessons specifically for this but what was told that unless I can do 2 laps (50M) of the front crawl, there's no point in trying to learn underwater swimming.)
Any helpful suggestions would be most appreciated.
You got very bad advice at your local pool. Either try another pool or another instructor. You definitely need to get in a routine of going to your local pool once a week. Part of that time can be with an instructor but after while it will just be you and the pool.
You apparently just aren't a water person and so everything about it is outside of your comfort level. When you get some help from an understanding instructor who breaks things down into baby steps then your comfort level will increase dramatically. After that you just need to go to the pool and play around and make being in the water fun. By the time you take your scuba class again you will at least be very comfortable in the water.
At this point due to your discomfort in the water you are overthinking things. Trust me
Gray
I can't say for certain about the advice you have gotten, but I think that the breaking things down into baby steps thing is right on target.
When I used to be a swim instructor, lesson one included holding the hand rail, walking down the steps, and going into the pool at the shallow end. I would progress into standing in the shallow end, breathing in, and just putting the mouth below the water to blow bubbles. From there, we would progress until the students could put their entire head under, and then they would stand out of the water to inhale. After that, you start to work on other things.
The point is, if you start very slowly, assuming that the student has almost never even been in the water, and then you progress from there, within a matter of weeks (doing this perhaps twice per week), you will produce a swimmer.
Anyone can do it if started at the very most basic of basics, progressing slowly from there. Unfortunately, having an improper start or a bad experience early out can scar a person for life, too often making them never want to go back again.
I also agree, don't overthink things. It will work against you. Keep looking until you find an instructor that will work with you at your level rather than forcing you to progress at a certain time limit goal (such as finishing a class within five sessions, etc.).
Edited by ScubaDadMiami, 23 December 2005 - 04:40 PM.
"For the diligent diver, closed circuit rebreathers are actually safer than open circuit scuba." Tom Mount
#10
Posted 24 December 2005 - 08:12 AM
#11
Posted 24 December 2005 - 09:30 AM
My brothers used to hold me under the water in our pool when I was very young and delighted in hearing me scream, knowing I'd get out of the pool never to return (at least for that day.)
When I was about 18 yrs I had a boyfriend who liked the water and I tried to learn to put my face under while holding my breath...cheeks puffed, eyes popping out...I managed to get my nose wet.
Then, I figured...well, if I can learn to get my face wet in the shower (yeah...it was that bad.) But...I did it, eventually. Ok....now I can get my face wet in the shower...so what!
My involvement in diving was almost a compulsive action on my part. Because of my marital situation at the time (or impending lack of...); I was forced to sell the horses I so dearly loved and had spent most of my time with. I had a huge void and needed to fill it with something other than another person. I signed up for OW classes, and informed the instructor at the time about my underwater problems. Very softly he told me..."we'll get you through it...not a problem."
First night at the pool we're in the water and lined up along the edge of the pool. I'm second in line. The "new" instructor, teaching his first class, looks at the first person points to a mark and tells her..."I need you to swim underwater (on one breath) to here. GO!!!" Off she went. Here I am saying "wait, Steve said you'd help me with this...etc., etc.," and the instructor smiles and says "I am...GO!!!!" I went. I came up for air once, coughing and sputtering took another breath and finished. "Great...by the end of the class you'll do your skin dive just fine." That's all he had to say and then went on to number 3 in line. I had water up my nose, it burned so badly. I had water in my eyes, I was coughing and I was miserable. If it wasn't for my stubborn streak to succeed, I would not have gone. If I had known that's how my first night in the pool was going to be I wouldn't have signed up. Once my instructors saw in that initial swim that I was determined and willing to do what needed to be done, they gave me all the time and attention I needed to get through, and beyond OW.
Now, I'm getting ready for my Rescue class so what have I been doing in between then and now?
These are the things I've done, and the things I've learned:
1. If you take a huge breath initially you have an immediate urge to let it out almost as soon as you submerge because of the change in pressure...even close to the surface.
2. That huge breath initially will also make you more bouyant, you'll be fighting to stay under even though at this point you're not realizing that's what happening because you haven't experienced enough bouyancy problems to recognize it directly.
3. That huge breath is also like a ritual before approaching impending doom...you're preparing yourself for failure.
SOLUTION: Take a small or normal breath before submerging, it will be easier to hold, you'll submerge effortlessly, you won't feel such a tremendous need to exhale immediately, and you'll be much more relaxed in the water.
4. Holding your breath is wrong and bad for you. I'm not sure if it's an anneurism or embolism that it can cause, but it's one of those.
5. Hip Shot mentioned that it's the carbon dioxide build up that makes us want to breathe. He's not the only person that's heard that.
SOLUTION: Firstly, there should always be a tiny tiny stream of bubbles coming from your mouth or your nose depending on what makes you comfortable. Second, we're taught to exercise and perform physical tasks aerobically - taking in lots of air at routine intervals. Teach yourself to perform anaerobically, by doing just what Hip Shot mentioned...when you feel the need to inhale, exhale a little bit...just a little, and then do it again if you can before you breath in. When you do breath in, don't take a huge breath, take a normal breath. Your muscles will have plenty of oxygen to do what they need to do, and you'll be training yourself to perform anaerobically which will allow you to swim longer distances underwater eventually. Do it when you're vacuuming your house, when you're mowing the lawn, at the gym, or whatever. It will become a more natural way of breathing while your body is in motion.
6. Position in the water...the deeper you go, the more pressure and the less air you have due to compression. But eventually, you'll need to be able to swim diagonally or straight down.
7. Water gets in your nose and it burns.
SOLUTION: From a standing position, put your arms out in front of you (I like mine hands to touch like a point, and have found it best to point them down toward the water a little...just a little), tilt your head to it's inline with your arms and hands, invision yourself swimming parallel to the surface about 2 feet below, take that normal breath, and push off. Don't stroke and kick furiously...stroke and kick slow and deliberately, resting comfortably knowing that you can surface easily anytime you need to. (Sometimes I end up about 4 feet down instead of 2 feet and bump the bottom of the kiddie swim area at the lake. I'm getting to where I know it's going to happen before it does because I can now feel the subtle change in pressure. You should be able to wear swim goggles (not your make), but goggles to practice so you can see where you're going.)
Remember...a steady but tiny stream of bubbles need to come from your nose or your mouth. If you're not good at just closing off your nasal passages and letting the air out your nose, then I suggest you push then out your nose. I have found for me, it's easier if I let it out my mouth. I do get a little water in my nose, but after the first time the burning tends to subside and it's no longer a problem.
I'm still having a hard time going straight down, but I can do it. Something happens when I come up and my nose floods with water. I haven't figured it out yet, but I will.
8. How do I get the distance?
SOLUTION: I have increased my distance with the following routine, BUT you especially, need to have someone present when you practice this because of the hyperventilating thing. SFRET taught me this: Take three breaths, deep and fast like you're hyperventilating; on the fourth take a normal breath, hold it and dive. This builds up oxygen, but will also build up carbon dioxide, so you must be proficient at letting out, letting out, and letting out. DO NOT ATTEMPT TO LEARN THIS ALONE! There is a risk of passing out for anyone who is learning this technique, but probably more of a risk for you.
You've now a lot of things to practice before your OW class. I had to make a commitment to practice as often as possible. I went to the lake 3 or 4 times a week and practiced in the public swim area with little kids splashing all around me. As soon as the water warms, I'll be back at it - I've still a long way to go.
Best of luck to you Caetlonn; I know you can do it!
Edited by Twinklez, 24 December 2005 - 09:37 AM.
#12
Posted 24 December 2005 - 10:53 AM
Stop trying to cheat, you have to swim 15.24 meters or 50 feet.
Try as I may Walter and I've read her post a number of times...and I do not see any request on her part to *cheat* nor to beat the system. I see someone who like myself when I was learning to scuba has to learn to swim and is asking for help either thru technique, guidance or just encouragement.
And in true SD form, a number of our very knowledgeable and caring members have done just that....they have given her advice on HOW to break down the process into very manageable steps, they have given her personal insight from other members who have had a difficult time doing the same she is attempting, they have given background as to why she is feeling the way she is and they have given some excellent techniques for both learning to swim and for succeeding in her open water swim test.
To suggest anything else is either an oversight or a result of insight that was not drawn from this post.
And as a matter of edification for my comments...I was a previous near drowning victim 3x including a full resuscitation, who did not know how to swim when I decided to learn scuba, so I completely understand what Annasea is going thru. I knew I could learn the book knowledge...and I did...passed with all A's...and usually 100%. But I knew I was going to be challenged in the water skills and that was an understatement...I flunked every pool session twice...mask clearing 3x and the swim...well somehow I got thru it but I lost count how many times I had to try. Ok so I didn't lose count but the number is so high that I won't publish it. I then flunked my open water weekend the first time as well. The point is that Annasea can do this if she wants and she obviously wants too. She will need some extra help and guidance and SUPPORT and she is part of a wonderful community that not only has a depth of knowledge that amazes me but also offers that knowledge openly, caringly and freely.
Hang in there girl...just take it very slow and I'll talk to you offline...I still remember my open water class like it was yesterday...despite being 12 years ago.
Contact me directly at Kamala@SingleDivers.com for your private or group travel needs or 864-557-6079 AND don't miss SD's 2018-2021 Trips! ....here! Most are once in a lifetime opportunities...don't miss the chance to go!!
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#13
Posted 24 December 2005 - 12:33 PM
It was a joke, wasn't it?Stop trying to cheat, you have to swim 15.24 meters or 50 feet.
On a completely different topic (it's my thread and I can hijack if I want to...sang to the tune of "It's My Party" ), I just figured out what the "Quote" button is for!
If you want to quote 2 people from different posts in your reply, hit the "Quote" button for the first post. You'll notice the + sign turns into a - and the button turns red. Scroll down to your second post and hit the "Quote" button again. Once again, you'll see the + turn to a - and the button turning red. Now, hit the "Add Reply" at the bottom of your screen. You'll now be taken to the page that allows you to enter your reply. Notice how both quotes appear in your reply box?
The nice thing about quoting this way, rather than cutting and pasting in a second quote as I used to do, is that when others are viewing your response with more than one quote, if they click on the red arrows seen in both quotes, they're taken back to the original post.
Also, you can even add from other forums this way.
(I'll post this as well in the Feedback forum.)
#14
Posted 24 December 2005 - 12:45 PM
Dennis
"Suppose you were an idiot ... And suppose you were a member of Congress ... But I repeat myself." --Mark Twain
#15
Posted 24 December 2005 - 12:47 PM
Every existing thing is born without reason, prolongs itself out of weakness, and dies by chance. - Jean-Paul Sartre
I feel the urge, the urge to submerge! -ScubaHawk - Raptor of the Deep !
WHO DAT!!!!
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