113 replies to this topic

[PerroneFord]

I'm a new diver... went with a 6' yellow octo with the swivel... I have it on a quick release that is also connected to a retractor

I love all the info floating around on this site.

Daniel

Try to think solutions through rather than just take people's word for things. Work through the logic.

[Geek]

I'm a new diver and was trained with the b/c integrated back up reg. I have been diving with mostly "old school" divers and went with a 6' yellow octo with the swivel and breath rightside or upside down reg when I purchase my own equiptment. I have it on a quick release that is also connected to a retractor that will reach my mouth. I would rather grab that myself than find the b/c type floating somewhere over my shoulder. And the OOA diver may just take the octo instead of taking mine....Hopefully.

I love all the info floating around on this site.

Daniel

No offense intended, but:

If this is a joke, you really should put a smiley in somewhere so we can tell it is a joke, like this:

If you are really a new diver, and this is your actual configuration, you're going to get a lot of reaction.
Fortunately, neither your configuration, nor the reaction, is likely to kill you.

[FritzCat66]

My 2 psi...

Until recently, I've been diving a fairly common rec setup with a short-hose, over-shoulder primary, and an Air2 integrated secondary/octo. However, as mentioned in this post, I have recently begun using a pony, so now I'm necklacing the pony reg.

Of course, now I could eliminate the integrated Air2, but actually I think I'll keep it for the flexibility it buys me. It gives me multiple options in case a buddy needs air: either give them my primary and switch to my Air2, or unstrap my bagged pony and hand them the whole rig, or start breathing off the pony myself while the buddy takes the primary. Or select the first option while removing the pony, then switch. Either way, makes sense for me to keep the Air2 for the flexibility and besides, it's not really much bigger than an inflator and I'm already used to it.

The one change I do think I'll make, however, is to replace the short hose on my primary. I'm not thinking about going the techie route with a seven-footer, but I am considering a five-footer, routed underarm. I'm trying out one of those new flex hoses instead of rubber with the new pony rig, also routed underarm. If I like that, then I'll probably go that route with my primary and the five-foot hose. Another decision to be made is whether to mount the five-foot hose with a swivel, or a fixed 90-degree adapter, or just straight in. Completely undecided on that point - I have a swivel now and it's great but I've heard of reliability issues and besides, with the flex hose I shouldn't have near the stiffness so it may not be necessary.

I have tested ascending on the Air2. It's not a bad ride, although it doesn't breathe near as nice as my Atomic primary, and I don't have near the flexibility with it in, but hey, all it's gotta do is get me to the surface, and it does that just fine.

>*< Fritz

[Bubble2Bubble]

On one of my Reg Sets I am using a Mares Viper Octo, I like this octo because it has a side discharge so it can be handed over to a diver in need of air whith-out having to turn it around or over.
The octo itself is a bit of a wet breather because of its design, having the exhaust valve/port at the same level as the mouth piece. But all in all its been a dependable octo and its slim design packs well into gear bags for travel.

Mike

[Geek]

My 2 psi...

Until recently, I've been diving a fairly common rec setup with a short-hose, over-shoulder primary, and an Air2 integrated secondary/octo. However, as mentioned in this post, I have recently begun using a pony, so now I'm necklacing the pony reg.

Of course, now I could eliminate the integrated Air2, but actually I think I'll keep it for the flexibility it buys me. It gives me multiple options in case a buddy needs air: either give them my primary and switch to my Air2, or unstrap my bagged pony and hand them the whole rig, or start breathing off the pony myself while the buddy takes the primary. Or select the first option while removing the pony, then switch. Either way, makes sense for me to keep the Air2 for the flexibility and besides, it's not really much bigger than an inflator and I'm already used to it.

The one change I do think I'll make, however, is to replace the short hose on my primary. I'm not thinking about going the techie route with a seven-footer, but I am considering a five-footer, routed underarm. I'm trying out one of those new flex hoses instead of rubber with the new pony rig, also routed underarm. If I like that, then I'll probably go that route with my primary and the five-foot hose. Another decision to be made is whether to mount the five-foot hose with a swivel, or a fixed 90-degree adapter, or just straight in. Completely undecided on that point - I have a swivel now and it's great but I've heard of reliability issues and besides, with the flex hose I shouldn't have near the stiffness so it may not be necessary.

I have tested ascending on the Air2. It's not a bad ride, although it doesn't breathe near as nice as my Atomic primary, and I don't have near the flexibility with it in, but hey, all it's gotta do is get me to the surface, and it does that just fine.

>*< Fritz

There is no need to eliminate the Air 2 in this situation. The Air 2 makes a fantastic inflator, you're already used to it and there is no harm in having a third regulator.

A 5 foot hose is fine for open water use, but is too short for penetration dives where you might have to exit in sequence. It is also too short for the techie wrap around your body type of configuration when wearing it. However, there is nothing wrong with a 5 foot hose for open water use. I use one when doing Caribbean diving.

Given your equipment at present, you might want to consider the following idea. Sling your pony like a deco bottle. In an OOA situation, once all the panic and confusion is settled, unclip the pony and hand it off to the OOA diver. No necklace should be used because you want to hand the whole thing off.

I haven't tried the new Miflex hoses but from what I have heard, you should not need a swivel with one of them. I am not one of the fanatics who thinks a swivel is going to kill you, but in general you don't want to overload yourself with gizmos, hence my reaction above to the combination of a swivel, a retractor, and a quick release all together. If one of those makes you more comfortable, fine. The DIR guys may go nuts, but I won't. If you need too many gadgets to get comfortable something more basic is wrong.

[FritzCat66]

A 5 foot hose is fine for open water use, but is too short for penetration dives where you might have to exit in sequence. It is also too short for the techie wrap around your body type of configuration when wearing it. However, there is nothing wrong with a 5 foot hose for open water use.

Yes, while I'm a very frequent diver, I'm strictly recreational, open water and not interested in tech or penetration diving. While I completely understand the need for my techie cave-diving buddies to have that long seven-footer all wrapped around, I really have no need of that. But I would like to streamline a bit, and I like the underarm configuration better than over-the-shoulder, which is why I'm considering the five-foot flex hose for my main reg.

Given your equipment at present, you might want to consider the following idea. Sling your pony like a deco bottle. In an OOA situation, once all the panic and confusion is settled, unclip the pony and hand it off to the OOA diver. No necklace should be used because you want to hand the whole thing off.

Believe me, I tried all the various pony configs: slung, cross-mounted, tank-mounted, bagged, left-sided, right-sided, upright, inverted, valve off, valve on, shiesh... The main problem I had with the slung configuration is that, as a photo guy who is often doing macros, the slung pony simply gets in the way too often, and risks damaging the reef given how close I hover. Given that my primary purpose for the pony is for bailout use as a solo diver, only secondarily for buddy diving, I have ultimately found I prefer the configuration like this: bagged, left-sided, using the Zeagle Razor combo valve/first stage for streamlining and reliability (one less seal) and compact size (valve + reg together still smaller than most valves by themselves), short hose routed under left arm, necklaced reg.

While not as easy to hand off as a slung bottle, having it bagged instead of hard-mounted to the tank still gives me the option to remove it fairly quickly & easily by popping just two Velcro straps off the top of the bag, yanking the reg off the necklace, and handing off to a buddy (or for use myself that way if my main rig becomes entangled and I need to remove my BC), but it's normally completely out of the way and streamlined, unlike slung.

The DIR guys may go nuts, but I won't. If you need too many gadgets to get comfortable something more basic is wrong.

Oh yeah, as far as DIR goes, I'm definitely a DIW diver, "Doing It Wrong", and proud of it! Lots of DIR no-no's: I'm happy as a solo diver (working towards the SDI Solo cert), and I prefer a highly ideosyncratic rig that works for ME and me alone, sticking with BC over BP/W, I like the ProQD lever inflator/deflator, I like my Air2, I like my splitfins, no long hose, I'm mounting my pony left, with the hose coming under my left arm, etc... definitely DIW as far as DIR is concerned!!!

Again, I understand the need for DIR standards in techie diving like the WKPP guys do, where it's all buddy-based and you need to know not only where all your own gear is, but where your buddy's gear is too. But for my style of solo (or with unreliable "instabuddies"), photo-centric, open-water reef diving, at recreational depths, DIR is waaaay too stringent and doesn't make sense to me. That being said, I do have tech buddies and have applied many of their ideas: I'm all-DIN, I carry not only a knife, but also a Z-knife and shears for extrication, Goodman light, leg pouch, etc... I even mounted a crotch strap to my ProQD (helps tremendously for those upside-down photo shoots!). What's important to me is that my gear is intuitive and obvious for ME to access and use, since I'm not counting on a buddy.

>*< Fritz
DIW Diver

[Geek]

A 5 foot hose is fine for open water use, but is too short for penetration dives where you might have to exit in sequence. It is also too short for the techie wrap around your body type of configuration when wearing it. However, there is nothing wrong with a 5 foot hose for open water use.

Yes, while I'm a very frequent diver, I'm strictly recreational, open water and not interested in tech or penetration diving. While I completely understand the need for my techie cave-diving buddies to have that long seven-footer all wrapped around, I really have no need of that. But I would like to streamline a bit, and I like the underarm configuration better than over-the-shoulder, which is why I'm considering the five-foot flex hose for my main reg.

Given your equipment at present, you might want to consider the following idea. Sling your pony like a deco bottle. In an OOA situation, once all the panic and confusion is settled, unclip the pony and hand it off to the OOA diver. No necklace should be used because you want to hand the whole thing off.

Believe me, I tried all the various pony configs: slung, cross-mounted, tank-mounted, bagged, left-sided, right-sided, upright, inverted, valve off, valve on, shiesh... The main problem I had with the slung configuration is that, as a photo guy who is often doing macros, the slung pony simply gets in the way too often, and risks damaging the reef given how close I hover. Given that my primary purpose for the pony is for bailout use as a solo diver, only secondarily for buddy diving, I have ultimately found I prefer the configuration like this: bagged, left-sided, using the Zeagle Razor combo valve/first stage for streamlining and reliability (one less seal) and compact size (valve + reg together still smaller than most valves by themselves), short hose routed under left arm, necklaced reg.

While not as easy to hand off as a slung bottle, having it bagged instead of hard-mounted to the tank still gives me the option to remove it fairly quickly & easily by popping just two Velcro straps off the top of the bag, yanking the reg off the necklace, and handing off to a buddy (or for use myself that way if my main rig becomes entangled and I need to remove my BC), but it's normally completely out of the way and streamlined, unlike slung.

The DIR guys may go nuts, but I won't. If you need too many gadgets to get comfortable something more basic is wrong.

Oh yeah, as far as DIR goes, I'm definitely a DIW diver, "Doing It Wrong", and proud of it! Lots of DIR no-no's: I'm happy as a solo diver (working towards the SDI Solo cert), and I prefer a highly ideosyncratic rig that works for ME and me alone, sticking with BC over BP/W, I like the ProQD lever inflator/deflator, I like my Air2, I like my splitfins, no long hose, I'm mounting my pony left, with the hose coming under my left arm, etc... definitely DIW as far as DIR is concerned!!!

Again, I understand the need for DIR standards in techie diving like the WKPP guys do, where it's all buddy-based and you need to know not only where all your own gear is, but where your buddy's gear is too. But for my style of solo (or with unreliable "instabuddies"), photo-centric, open-water reef diving, at recreational depths, DIR is waaaay too stringent and doesn't make sense to me. That being said, I do have tech buddies and have applied many of their ideas: I'm all-DIN, I carry not only a knife, but also a Z-knife and shears for extrication, Goodman light, leg pouch, etc... I even mounted a crotch strap to my ProQD (helps tremendously for those upside-down photo shoots!). What's important to me is that my gear is intuitive and obvious for ME to access and use, since I'm not counting on a buddy.

>*< Fritz
DIW Diver

Sounds like you're doing fine with working out what works best for you. I agree with the idea of experimenting until you're happy with the result.

[PerroneFord]

DIR is waaaay too stringent and doesn't make sense to me.

If there is anything you might like explained in the system, I'd be happy to try. Not trying to change your mind or your feelings. Just an offer.

[Geek]

DIR is waaaay too stringent and doesn't make sense to me.

If there is anything you might like explained in the system, I'd be happy to try. Not trying to change your mind or your feelings. Just an offer.

The DIR system makes perfect sense, IF you are doing penetration diving. The problem with DIR is it isn't the one and only way to configure your gear, particularly if what you want to do is make a lot of 50' reef dives to look at the fish and corals.

For instance, Air 2's (octos are the topic here) are clearly non-DIR and they aren't designed for technical diving, but if you try to talk to a DIR type about them the first thing you hear is "Air2s are junk." or "Air2s will kill you." or "You can't find it if it isn't strapped to your neck." or "You can't control your bouyancy while trying to ascend in an OOA situation." or some other lame excuse. I don't agree. They are designed for recreational, open water, use and when used as intended they are fine.

DIR needs to be placed in context to make sense, and the context is penetration diving. If the DIR crowd could accept that some of their recommendations are based on reasoning that doesn't apply in open water, recreational, settings they would be much more convincing. Too many DIR types cross the line from being proponents to zealots. (No offense Perrone. You've been a valuable contributer here over a long period of time.)

Edited by Geek, 06 September 2008 - 08:05 PM.

[PerroneFord]

If you don't mind, I'd like to make two comments regarding what you've had to say here.

1. DIR is a holistic system. And I think that many people who do not dive the system don't really resonate with this. DIR is not designed for penetration, or OW, or any other kinds of diving. The least of DIR if the gear config, but it is the most visible thing that people see. The gear configuration is about optimization. Having your backup reg around the neck puts in in an easily accessible place, and honestly, it's really pretty optimal. So if that location IS optimal, why put it anywhere else? True DIR divers won't tell you how to configure your gear. Quite honestly, we don't really care all that much how you configure your gear. We do care how we configure our gear, and how our buddies are configured.

2. Specifically regarding Air2s, many of the early one's were junk. And like many things, first impressions are hard to shake. Also, because of the holistic nature of DIR, having a regulator come from the left side, and have to be operated by the left hand is less than optimal. So the unit simply doesn't fit into DIR diving. Personally, I feel that the AIR2 complicates a controlled ascent somewhat. Not saying it can't be done, or that it doesn't work. But it adds a complication to what is already a stressful scenario. Knowing that, what is the primary reason for using it versus using something different?


I tend to disagree with you. The DIR system is not characterized by zealots. However, the zealots are clearly the most visible portion of DIR. So, it stands to reason that if your primary interaction with DIR people is those very outspoken zealots online, then you are going to have a skewed perspective of both the divers, and the system. This is understandable, and expected. I have been fortunate to surround myself with the originators of the system, and those who truly understand it and practice it regularly. And my impressions based on that interaction do not mirror those of others who have not had the same access. With one notable exception, I cannot think of any early DIR pioneers who've had anything to say about how others dive, how they configure their gear, or anything else outside the DIR community.

I hope you understand that I am not trying to direct any of this at you personally. Over time, my feelings and interactions regarding DIR have changed in some ways. I still believe in the system, but prefer to keep that to myself for the most part unless someone asks my view.

Thanks,

-P

DIR is waaaay too stringent and doesn't make sense to me.

If there is anything you might like explained in the system, I'd be happy to try. Not trying to change your mind or your feelings. Just an offer.

The DIR system makes perfect sense, IF you are doing penetration diving. The problem with DIR is it isn't the one and only way to configure your gear, particularly if what you want to do is make a lot of 50' reef dives to look at the fish and corals.

For instance, Air 2's (octos are the topic here) are clearly non-DIR and they aren't designed for technical diving, but if you try to talk to a DIR type about them the first thing you hear is "Air2s are junk." or "Air2s will kill you." or "You can't find it if it isn't strapped to your neck." or "You can't control your bouyancy while trying to ascend in an OOA situation." or some other lame excuse. I don't agree. They are designed for recreational, open water, use and when used as intended they are fine.

If the DIR system wasn't characterized by zealots, it would probably catch on better. (No offense intended to you Perrone, you've been a terrific contributor here over a long period of time.)

[Geek]

If you don't mind, I'd like to make two comments regarding what you've had to say here.

1. DIR is a holistic system. And I think that many people who do not dive the system don't really resonate with this. DIR is not designed for penetration, or OW, or any other kinds of diving. The least of DIR if the gear config, but it is the most visible thing that people see. The gear configuration is about optimization. Having your backup reg around the neck puts in in an easily accessible place, and honestly, it's really pretty optimal. So if that location IS optimal, why put it anywhere else? True DIR divers won't tell you how to configure your gear. Quite honestly, we don't really care all that much how you configure your gear. We do care how we configure our gear, and how our buddies are configured.

2. Specifically regarding Air2s, many of the early one's were junk. And like many things, first impressions are hard to shake. Also, because of the holistic nature of DIR, having a regulator come from the left side, and have to be operated by the left hand is less than optimal. So the unit simply doesn't fit into DIR diving. Personally, I feel that the AIR2 complicates a controlled ascent somewhat. Not saying it can't be done, or that it doesn't work. But it adds a complication to what is already a stressful scenario. Knowing that, what is the primary reason for using it versus using something different?


I tend to disagree with you. The DIR system is not characterized by zealots. However, the zealots are clearly the most visible portion of DIR. So, it stands to reason that if your primary interaction with DIR people is those very outspoken zealots online, then you are going to have a skewed perspective of both the divers, and the system. This is understandable, and expected. I have been fortunate to surround myself with the originators of the system, and those who truly understand it and practice it regularly. And my impressions based on that interaction do not mirror those of others who have not had the same access. With one notable exception, I cannot think of any early DIR pioneers who've had anything to say about how others dive, how they configure their gear, or anything else outside the DIR community.

I hope you understand that I am not trying to direct any of this at you personally. Over time, my feelings and interactions regarding DIR have changed in some ways. I still believe in the system, but prefer to keep that to myself for the most part unless someone asks my view.

Thanks,

-P

Actually I agree with what you've said, not only in this post, but 99% of the time when I've seen your posts on this forum. However, I've never met an Air 2 "zealot", so I would have to say the zealots are one of the distinguishing features of DIR. As a result, when someone says something like "DIR is too stringent." or he'd like to experiment a bit with his equipment, I can relate. Call someone a "stroke" just once and you'll never convince him of anything.

In fact, I'm a bit worried about our earlier poster with the long hose on the octo. I didn't want to turn him off, but I really couldn't tell what was going on with his post. The last thing I want to do is treat him the way I am saying many of the DIR guys act. If he is still reading this I hope he'll return.

Back to the Air2, I hear what you're saying about the DIR system, but on the issue of finding the octo, if you can't find an Air2, the implication is you can't find your inflator, so that one just doesn't convince me. As far as controlling the ascent, in warm clear water with minimal gear, I pretty much swim everything up and down, so control isn't much of an issue, and because I find the thing is a superior inflator mechanism, I might even argue that it improves control, particularly when it is in place as a third regulator. This argument also tends to refute the first argument. If the problem is you can't find your inflator, how much do you really need it for controlling your ascent?

As to the "junk" argument, I don't know who first put these on the market, but the Air2 is made by ScubaPro and it has become one of those terms that applies to all similar devices, like Xerox means a copy to everyone who isn't defending Xerox's trademark. The ScubaPro Air2 is a decent recreational grade regulator. ScubaPro also makes high performance regulators. When used as intended, the Air2 is not junk. In fact it is superior to most recreational octos. I grant that there are similar style devices from other manufacturers that are not as well made, but there are also low quality conventional regulators, BCs, reels, etc. yet the only time the word "junk" seems to come up is in the context of these devices and there is never a distinction made between the manufacturers. As a result, I think the "junk" argument is one that simply reinforces the zealot image of DIR folks, regardless of how it got started.

BTW: One of the DIR arguments that I do agree with is the idea that the "octo" should be the same quality as your primary and not a place to save a few bucks. It is intended to be used in a high stress situation and needs to be able to perform as well as your primary.

[PerroneFord]

Thank you for your reasoned reply. I'm somewhat frightened that you agree with me 99% of the time. I don't know if *I* agree with me that much! LOL!

Just a couple of things:

I think that DIR, like any other "thing" that captures strong emotion, can create those who are zealots. Many people equate DIR to a religion or a cult. I think that's a bit harsh, but I do see where they are coming from. And it's often the most recent converts who are the least tolerant, and most fervent. This is unfortunate. The "stroke" term is an unfortunate word that had dogged DIR for a long time, and to be honest, the long term DIR folks, as well as the original folks, don't use the term. Well, one does but he's widely known.

It's important to note that DIR isn't really as stringent as you might think. There is a lot of flexibility in the system. The core tenets remain the same, and the base of gear (bp/w, long hose, bungied backup, rubber fins, etc.) all stay the same. But if you were to see the divers in the WKPP or the EKPP, you'd see an amazing variety of gear outside of that.

I did a dive yesterday. Due to circumstances, I had to borrow a recreational BC to do the dive. The inflator and corrugated hose simply would not stay in place. So I had to hunt my inflator every time I wanted it, and it was often drifting behind my left shoulder which is a devil of a place to find it when you want to add gas to the BC. I did this in 10ft of vis for nearly half an hour. Was I less DIR because I had a recreational BC? You can bet that I sure wanted my bp/w when I was dealing with the inflator issue! Had that been an air2, and had I actually needed it, it would have created a potentially stressful scenario. A properly fitted and adjusted BC with a solid velcro strap that held the inflator the way it should, would have been less of a problem.

I don't know who first marketed the Air2 type device. However, I think we can agree that some breathe very well, like the Atomics, and some breathe very poorly. I've tried a few of these and that is how I would characterize them. I would not say any of the ones I've tried breathe as well as my primary. And to me, that's important. Again it gets back to that DIR idea of using the best gear you can, all the time. If I know that my regs breathe well, at 10ft or 300ft, why would I want to use something less, that had more limitations? I don't change my core gear just because I am doing a recreational dive and not a cave dive. And all the muscle memory I've developed that allows me to react quickly in an emergency, carries over in all environments.

The idea of having your backup (we don't say octo) reg be as good as the primary, is not a DIR thing. In fact, early DIR actually said NOT to do that. The issue for us, is that since we donate the primary in an emergency, we'd be left with an inferior regulator. And because many of us do decompression, or penetration diving, we'd be using that regulator for a WHILE. As cheap as second stages are, why bother to use something that's not excellent? Early DIR dictated that backup reg be detuned or be non-balanced because you didn't want it free flowing while scootering. Now that many are adjustable, this is no longer a significant concern.

Again, I am not trying to win hearts and minds here, or "convert" anyone. DIR is certainly not a system with wide appeal, and with good reason. You're either looking for something like it, or you're not. I will say this. It's really nice to be able to travel all over the world, and have buddies you can get in the water with, and you already know their training level, and their skill set. It's a great comfort to know your buddy is going to have sharp skills, and be solid in the water. To me, that's the biggest draw.

Actually I agree with what you've said, not only in this post, but 99% of the time when I've seen your posts on this forum. However, I've never met an Air 2 "zealot", so I would have to say the zealots are one of the distinguishing features of DIR. As a result, when someone says something like "DIR is too stringent." or he'd like to experiment a bit with his equipment, I can relate. Call someone a "stroke" just once and you'll never convince him of anything.

In fact, I'm a bit worried about our earlier poster with the long hose on the octo. I didn't want to turn him off, but I really couldn't tell what was going on with his post. The last thing I want to do is treat him the way I am saying many of the DIR guys act. If he is still reading this I hope he'll return.

Back to the Air2, I hear what you're saying about the DIR system, but on the issue of finding the octo, if you can't find an Air2, the implication is you can't find your inflator, so that one just doesn't convince me. As far as controlling the ascent, in warm clear water with minimal gear, I pretty much swim everything up and down, so control isn't much of an issue, and because I find the thing is a superior inflator mechanism, I might even argue that it improves control, particularly when it is in place as a third regulator. This argument also tends to refute the first argument. If the problem is you can't find your inflator, how much do you really need it for controlling your ascent?

As to the "junk" argument, I don't know who first put these on the market, but the Air2 is made by ScubaPro and it has become one of those terms that applies to all similar devices, like Xerox means a copy to everyone who isn't defending Xerox's trademark. The ScubaPro Air2 is a decent recreational grade regulator. ScubaPro also makes high performance regulators. When used as intended, the Air2 is not junk. In fact it is superior to most recreational octos. I grant that there are similar style devices from other manufacturers that are not as well made, but there are also low quality conventional regulators, BCs, reels, etc. yet the only time the word "junk" seems to come up is in the context of these devices and there is never a distinction made between the manufacturers. As a result, I think the "junk" argument is one that simply reinforces the zealot image of DIR folks, regardless of how it got started.

BTW: One of the DIR arguments that I do agree with is the idea that the "octo" should be the same quality as your primary and not a place to save a few bucks. It is intended to be used in a high stress situation and needs to be able to perform as well as your primary.

[Geek]

Your experience with the borrowed BC illustrates the importance of gear that fits and performs well. If you can't get to the inflator because it is floating away, that would definitely be an annoyance. My guess is you are used to using a short corrugated hose (normal for DIR) on your own wing and the borrowed BC had one longer than you are used to. Your inflator hose on your regulator is sized for your wing and was too short vs. the corrugated hose on the borrowed BC, resulting in the corrugated hose folding backwards. In other words, the pieces didn't fit.

You may be right about some of the newer DIR types being the ones most likely to criticize, but whomever they are, they take the fun right out of the sport. There are boards I won't post on, and at least one boat I won't dive from, because of bad experiences with jerks. Even though there may not be many of them, if you get into this sport enough you'll run into them.

Now if mountainminnow will just come back, we can give him conflicting advice on how to sort out his alternate.

Edited by Geek, 07 September 2008 - 10:36 AM.

[FritzCat66]

If there is anything you might like explained in the system, I'd be happy to try. Not trying to change your mind or your feelings. Just an offer.

LOL! I appreciate the offer, but believe me, I understand plenty about the whole DIR philosophy, and I do respect it, in its proper context... however, that context is NOT about Solo, open-water diving, which is what I am interested in (although I'm sure it works fine in a solo context for someone who is already a DIR diver). DIR diving is about standardization, and reliance upon a buddy following the same standards (Jablonski says it explicitly: "Central to the DIR diving system is the concept of a unified team")... whereas Solo is about being as ideosyncratic as necessary, because it's only going to be YOU down there to save your own a**.

So if it makes more sense for me to run my pony hose left-sided because my intuition is for "left hand grab, right hand use" (or "left hand grab, mouth use" in the case of a reg), then that's what's best for me, despite anyone else's well-intentioned standard. And what on this blue earth would I as a solo diver need a seven-foot hose for? If my rig gets entangled, I remove my pony and switch to it, get out of my rig, and fix it (or surface) - all that extra hose would just get in the way. If it makes me more streamlined to go with a five-footer, and to save an entire hose with an Air2, then who is DIR to tell me otherwise? And don't even get me started on the splitfins... which I as a reef photographer (who used to use paddles) find give me far more fine maneuverability close to the reef whilst kicking up far less silt. The list goes on...

No, I shan't get into yet another online argument about DIR... but like I said, I do appreciate the offer, and I have actually adopted a couple of ideas from the DIR book - but only after trying it out and determining that it makes sense for me. And I have to say, most of the DIR guys I've met in real life are not zealots (although the ones from online... have been a mixed bag), but rather helpful, good divers whom I respect. However, as far as DIR goes, I'm simply DIW - Doing It Wrong - and happy about it!

>*< Fritz

[PerroneFord]

And what on this blue earth would I as a solo diver need a seven-foot hose for?

...and I have actually adopted a couple of ideas from the DIR book - but only after trying it out and determining that it makes sense for me.

Believe it or not, I find the 7ft hose wraps more cleanly around my body than anything else. Even less of an entanglement hazard than the former 5ft hose I used. I'm also a bigger guy than most, so the 5ft hose might make more sense for someone with less girth.

As to borrowing ideas from DIR or other systems, I think you've hit on the major point of DIR. And that is to actually THINK about what you are doing, and make conscious choices that work best for you. That is a VERY DIR concept.

The DIR system of unified team encompasses far more than a good buddy. And in your case, I think some of the other pieces might be of great benefit. In ocean diving, the captain becomes an integral part of that unified team. Someone who knows your plan, where you are going, how long you should be down there, and when to come looking if you don't surface. It extends to families who should expect calls from you when you return safely from your dive. It could extend to the local chamber if you are going to be doing some more difficult dives. DAN might well be a part of your unified team in some cases. For those of us doing some more technical dives, the local law enforcement office, as well as our surface support become part of that unified team.

So even as a solo diver, you are not an island out there man. I have a few friends who solo. Fortunately, most are quite experienced, and have spent adequate time preparing themselves for what they are doing. If you choose to dive that way, who am I or anyone else to tell you what to do? All I ask is that you please try to do it as safely as you can.

Fair enough?