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My worst flight.....


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#31 georoc01

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Posted 29 March 2009 - 09:00 AM

Most of the time, a fly-by-wire aircraft would require intensive pilot attention to a variety of things ranging from fuel load distribution to the actual moving of the flight controls. For example, in the old days, a pilot flying an F-4 near the speed of sound would have to use rudders (the thingys on the floor fighter jocks normally use as foot rests) to control roll, which would normally be controlled by ailerons (lateral movement of stick thingy between your legs). In the F-18, lateral stick inputs give you roll, regardless of flight regime, but the computer is moving whatever control surface(s) needs to be moved to achieve what the pilot is commanding by stick input.


Excellent reply, however although all new fighters and bombers are fly-by-wire, they do not have to meet the safety standards of a commercial airliner or even a small single engine General Aviation airplane. And, they all have the option to pull down the visor and pull that handle between your legs, where by you shoot out the top (or bottom in some cases) of the airplane and come down on a parachute.

The B-777 was Boeing's first Fly-By-Wire airplane, but it still has controls that are cable to hydraulic interface from the cockpit. The trim systems and the inboard spoilers are not fly-by-wire. I believe the 787 is all fly-by-wire. The philosophy is still different for Boeing than for Airbus and hence my comment.


Dennis is not alone in his opinion on this. While I am certainly not an expert a friend of mine owns a company that trains mechanics for the airline industry as well as performing inspections for manufacturers as well. Apparently the Airbus craft are much more challenging to work on from a design standpoint as well.

Personally since United and Frontier both use Airbus craft, I fly them frequently myself, as generally other priorties when choosing flights come ahead of an aircraft presence (a direct flight vs having to make a connection for example).

#32 Capn Jack

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Posted 29 March 2009 - 10:23 AM

Dennis is not alone in his opinion on this. While I am certainly not an expert a friend of mine owns a company that trains mechanics for the airline industry as well as performing inspections for manufacturers as well. Apparently the Airbus craft are much more challenging to work on from a design standpoint as well.

Personally since United and Frontier both use Airbus craft, I fly them frequently myself, as generally other priorties when choosing flights come ahead of an aircraft presence (a direct flight vs having to make a connection for example).

I've tried not to offer my opinions - even though as always I have an HP-130 full of them. I really don't have enough information for me to give what I think would be an "expert" opinion that the readers would expect coming from an aviator. Maybe we have someone onboard who can.

For my choice of flights or airlines, I do consider the risk differentials to be statistically insignificant..
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#33 Dennis

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Posted 29 March 2009 - 08:09 PM

Capt. Jack, you are very likely correct, the differences are most likely statistically insignificant regarding the safety factors for Airbus vs. Boeing, vs. McDonnel Douglas, vs. any other commercial Air Transport Manufacturer that gets an FAA Type Certificate. It's just my preference and I will try my very best to fly other aircraft unless Airbus is all there is. Incidentally, the only two Airbus aircraft I have not flown on is the A-340 and A-380. The old A-300's? Well they aren't fly-by-wire and they are really rattly, always were, even when they were new.
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#34 Racer184

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Posted 30 March 2009 - 04:40 PM

Here are a few bad flights

Edited by Racer184, 30 March 2009 - 04:41 PM.


#35 Capn Jack

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Posted 30 March 2009 - 07:47 PM

Capt. Jack, you are very likely correct, the differences are most likely statistically insignificant regarding the safety factors for Airbus vs. Boeing, vs. McDonnel Douglas, vs. any other commercial Air Transport Manufacturer that gets an FAA Type Certificate. It's just my preference and I will try my very best to fly other aircraft unless Airbus is all there is. Incidentally, the only two Airbus aircraft I have not flown on is the A-340 and A-380. The old A-300's? Well they aren't fly-by-wire and they are really rattly, always were, even when they were new.

Good catch - I was talking about insignificant differences in SAFETY...

Now, as to Boeing vs Airbus, US vs France, - I would always go for Boeing. While it might be said Boeing enjoyed a monopolistic advantage for many years, they never to my knowledge sacrificed good design principles in arrogance.

Given the governmental support for Airbus, allowing them to dump their products on the market and win far more share than the product merited, I will probably carry a disdain for Airbus to my grave. I am clearly biased on this - still have a bitter taste from the sacrifices my colleagues had to make in 86, taking the long road to Khadafi's hooch because our French allies wouldn't let us fly over them... let alone join us for the party.
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#36 Dennis

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Posted 30 March 2009 - 08:00 PM

Capn. Jack, I work for Air Combat Command. The French still mess with us. I think they do just because they can. Had a similar problem with some HC-130s last June that were trying to get to an exercize in Souda Bay.
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#37 peterbj7

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Posted 31 March 2009 - 03:25 AM

But have you seen that France wants to rejoin NATO? That may signal a switch in attitudes.

#38 weescot

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Posted 31 March 2009 - 10:08 AM

But have you seen that France wants to rejoin NATO? That may signal a switch in attitudes.

Miss pedantic here - they never left as political members - they now simply want to be part of the military command structure again, although in Bosnia, it was difficult to believe they ever left it and I openly called the 4 star "General Sneaky Beaky" (becuase I got away with a lot....). But the French will always be French - stubborn, but great cooks and winemakers....
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#39 peterbj7

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Posted 31 March 2009 - 04:20 PM

How many people know that the French learned how to grow grapes and make wine from the English?

#40 Dennis

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Posted 01 April 2009 - 06:32 AM

I think we've hijacked this thread enough. The French will always mess with us, just because they can.

I want to read about other peoples worst flights.
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#41 WreckWench

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Posted 01 April 2009 - 07:09 AM

I think we've hijacked this thread enough. The French will always mess with us, just because they can.

I want to read about other peoples worst flights.



:cheerleader:

And by getting back on topic I don't have to remind everyone that discussions about political topics are a 'no no'. :cheerleader: So :cheerleader: again! :birthday:

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#42 WreckWench

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Posted 01 April 2009 - 07:13 AM

At one point in my life I didn't fly commercial aircraft for 22 years. Missed out on a lot of great dive travel.

The reason? I was returning to LAX from Chicago. The plane did a sharp descent after passing over the mountains. It leveled off and was getting ready to touch down on the runway. Suddenly the nose pointed up and the pilot gunned the engines. I looked down (not very far) to see another plane crossing our runway just beneath us. Whew.

Got to the Long Beach airport afterwards and boarded a Catalina seaplane to fly back to the island. I sat in the co-pilots seat for the flight. All was well during the late afternoon flight. As we approached Avalon with the sun low in the horizon ahead of us, the pilot touched down on the water. I looked ahead and saw the HUGE Coast Guard mooring can dead ahead of us. The plane bounced on a wave and the pilot, who hadn't seen it due to the sun in his eyes, quickly gunned the plane's engines and we pulled up just in time... grazing the skin of the aircraft on the can. Double whew!

I figured that was two strikes in one day. I stopped flying and took the train everywhere. I wasn't about to try for a third strike... until 22 years later. It was time for a class reunion at Harvard, and my then GF refused to take the 3-day train trip in each direction. I told her she'd have to hold my hand the entire flight. Once we were airborn, I was fine and have flown ever since... especially if there is a great dive destination involved!



Wow! Those do take the cake! :cheerleader:

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#43 WreckWench

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Posted 01 April 2009 - 07:14 AM

Well, I remember one flight from San Francisco to Vegas in the summertime.

I thought it was strange when I showed up at the gate and there was no one there. Turned out this was the coors party plane and just about everyone else on the flight was a part of this group that was drinking heavily in the bar across from the gate.

So we cross over from California into the Nevada basin, and the heat causes the plane to drop significantly, like the biggest drop you have ever taken on a roller coaster.

Needless to say, every barf bag in the seatback was then immediately in use.

So you can imagine the smell for the remainder of the flight.


You win. We can close this thread now.



Oh my..... :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :birthday:

I have to agree with Capn Jack on this one! :cheerleader:

Contact me directly at Kamala@SingleDivers.com for your private or group travel needs or 864-557-6079 AND don't miss SD's 2018-2021 Trips! ....here! Most are once in a lifetime opportunities...don't miss the chance to go!!
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"Imitation is the sincerest flattery." - Gandhi
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Kamala Shadduck c/o SingleDivers.com LLC
2234 North Federal Hwy, #1010 Boca Raton, FL 33431
formerly...
710 Dive Buddy Lane; Salem, SC 29676
864-557-6079 tel/celfone/office or tollfree fax 888-480-0906

#44 WreckWench

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Posted 01 April 2009 - 07:23 AM

Yikes!!! After reading all of your posts, my "bad" flight experiences pale in comparison. I'm feeling very humbled and VERY grateful. My sister claims that her worst experience is finding a poopy diaper in the seat pocket in front of her. Seriously. :cheerleader:



UH....THAT would be a HORRIBLE FLIGHT!!!


But the truth is...flying is the safest form of transporation even if the few mishaps get a lot of press.

Contact me directly at Kamala@SingleDivers.com for your private or group travel needs or 864-557-6079 AND don't miss SD's 2018-2021 Trips! ....here! Most are once in a lifetime opportunities...don't miss the chance to go!!
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"Imitation is the sincerest flattery." - Gandhi
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SingleDivers.com...often imitated...never duplicated!

Kamala Shadduck c/o SingleDivers.com LLC
2234 North Federal Hwy, #1010 Boca Raton, FL 33431
formerly...
710 Dive Buddy Lane; Salem, SC 29676
864-557-6079 tel/celfone/office or tollfree fax 888-480-0906

#45 WreckWench

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Posted 01 April 2009 - 07:31 AM

"In my years of flight...
1. I've been on a plane with a burning engine...big shooting flames and all. (We landed quite safely on the other engine but I haven't flown NW very much since that time.)
2. I've been on a plane with a burning electrical smell...we turned around and went back to our departure airport but I haven't flown Delta as much since that time either. (I know not fair but people are products of their experiences!)
3. I've been on a plane that couldn't raise the landing gear so returned to the departure airport...and no I haven't flown United that much since that time.
4. I've been on a number of delayed flights...and even a few cancelled/rescheduled ones with AA but I've always managed to adjust accordingly and figured its better to be delayed or cancelled rather than experience ANY of the problems I've had on other carriers. :cheerleader:
And no I'm not a huge AA.com fan...I fly them cuz their hub is where I live...DFW. However other carriers fly in and out of here so I could choose any carrier I wanted for the most part."



Ya know I forgot my famous CO experience....while in college I was departing for Europe to do a year abroad. I had one domestic flight and then onto NY for the international flight. I was going in a bit early to do some sightseeing in NY. As they pulled the gang plank away...we heard this ripping crushing metal sound...they had accidently hooked the door of hte plane and ripped it off its hinges.

Not only did we not fly out that day but it took a full additional day to get us to NY and I barely made my int'l flight. :cheerleader:

So knock on wood....the worst I've had so far with AA has been weather, mechical (on ground not in flight), ATC delays but you'll have that with everyone.

Oh yes I was once on a flight that had a federal prisoner being transferred with armed air marshalls. THAT was freaky!

Contact me directly at Kamala@SingleDivers.com for your private or group travel needs or 864-557-6079 AND don't miss SD's 2018-2021 Trips! ....here! Most are once in a lifetime opportunities...don't miss the chance to go!!
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"Imitation is the sincerest flattery." - Gandhi
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Kamala Shadduck c/o SingleDivers.com LLC
2234 North Federal Hwy, #1010 Boca Raton, FL 33431
formerly...
710 Dive Buddy Lane; Salem, SC 29676
864-557-6079 tel/celfone/office or tollfree fax 888-480-0906




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