87 replies to this topic

[Diverbrian]

any diver diving a mixed gas is a technical diver! Interesting...that makes all us nitrox divers certified under 40% still tech divers. 

regular compressed air (21% O2) is "technically" mixed gas...

.....especially if taken to 160 ft. for 20 minutes like some of my dive buddies like to do!

[TraceMalin]

::Swoon::

Now, if you'd only be willing to die under 200 feet of cold deep black water because it's fun... 

Trace

Trace ~ You had me at the "swoon"

200' sounds doable and if your along how could it be anything but fun.

I have seen 147' already, 200 is just another 53'.

My water or your's?

Well, you should come to mine in November!

Then... take me back to yours!

Trace

[Walter]

any diver diving a mixed gas is a technical diver! Interesting...that makes all us nitrox divers certified under 40% still tech divers.

While I see no validity in the term, I have read many definitions. Most definitions have not included nitrox for many years.

NAUI's definition, for example, includes dives in which the mix is changed during the dive.

what would you call someone who either dives beyond recreational/sport diving depths aka 130ft or someone who takes a mixed gas class say over 40% or a rebreather class or even a decompression class?

A deep diver, an advanced nitrox diver, a rebreather diver and a decompression diver. They are not the same, calling them technical divers gives the false impression that they are. Even if you understand they are not the same, calling them technical divers communicates no real information.

[Cold_H2O]

Well, you should come to mine in November! 

Then... take me back to yours!

Trace

I would love to come to yours in November, but it can't be done :dltears: (See other thread)
Between work and a few other committments I am pretty much stuck in Seattle all of November. I will have to see if I can make some adjustments.

Any change of having you come to mine first?

Edited by gis_gal, 19 October 2005 - 07:43 AM.

[TraceMalin]

A deep diver, an advanced nitrox diver, a rebreather diver and a decompression diver. They are not the same, calling them technical divers gives the false impression that they are. Even if you understand they are not the same, calling them technical divers communicates no real information.

That's true. Just like a tank labled nitrox contains no real info.

I think "technical diving" is any dive in which the industry at one time would have whined and said, "Now cut that out!" and diver's labled as technical divers see the term from their own points of view.

Trace

[ScubaHawk]

I like your "Techreational" phrasing. I'm going to start giving that as an answer - and it sounds so much better than what I would have come up with - "Recnical" which sounds like a Proctology related field.

[TraceMalin]

I like your "Techreational" phrasing. I'm going to start giving that as an answer - and it sounds so much better than what I would have come up with - "Recnical" which sounds like a Proctology related field.

Hawk,

DIR actually means "Doing It Rectally."

Just so you know, I didn't come up with the term "techreational" it's been around for a while.

And, um, yes, stick with Barbie jokes & please don't try to come up wit names for scuba!

Trace

[George]

what would you call someone who either dives beyond recreational/sport diving depths aka 130ft or someone who takes a mixed gas class say over 40% or a rebreather class or even a decompression class?

A deep diver, an advanced nitrox diver, a rebreather diver and a decompression diver. They are not the same, calling them technical divers gives the false impression that they are. Even if you understand they are not the same, calling them technical divers communicates no real information.

Ok so lets say they were not taking a class nor did they have any formal trainging in deep diving or decompression diving. Now what would you call someone who dives below 130 ft? Or does a decompression dive?

Are they still a recreational or sport diver?

[Dive_Girl]

Are they still a recreational or sport diver?

HEY! You don't get to use the term sport diver! That's mine! Remember I'm a self-proclaimed "sport" diver - a "recreational" diver with a wild side....:anna:

[George]

Are they still a recreational or sport diver?

HEY! You don't get to use the term sport diver! That's mine! Remember I'm a self-proclaimed "sport" diver - a "recreational" diver with a wild side....:anna:

My apologies and my kind of diver!

[Walter]

Ok so lets say they were not taking a class nor did they have any formal trainging in deep diving or decompression diving. Now what would you call someone who dives below 130 ft?

A deep diver.

Or does a decompression dive?

A decompression diver.

Are they still a recreational or sport diver?

People are either diving for work (commercial divers) or because it's a hobby (recreational diver).

HEY! You don't get to use the term sport diver! That's mine! Remember I'm a self-proclaimed "sport" diver - a "recreational" diver with a wild side....

Sorry Darlin', but the term sport diver has been around longer than you've been diving. It was the common term in use before recreational diver became common. It was used to distinguish between those who dive for work & those who dive for fun. I believe is was even used in one of the Airport movies (Airport 1977, if I'm not mistaken).

[George]

But Walter these people are not trained to do that kind of diving. Nor should they be if they have been trained not to exceed certain levels/boundaries. However, even if they have taken training in that realm, they are not purely recretational divers.

[Dive_Girl]

Sorry Darlin', but the term sport diver has been around longer than you've been diving. It was the common term in use before recreational diver became common. It was used to distinguish between those who dive for work & those who dive for fun. I believe is was even used in one of the Airport movies (Airport 1977, if I'm not mistaken).

WHAT!!??? No way - and here I thought I was being original - nevermind there used to be a magazine called Sport Diver.....

[Walter]

But Walter these people are not trained to do that kind of diving. Nor should they be if they have been trained not to exceed certain levels/boundaries. However, even if they have taken training in that realm, they are not purely recretational divers.

Of course they are. They are doing it for recreation.

[jholley309]

I never scoff at divers.  It's usually not the fault of the diver if his skills are lacking.  In most cases, they are doing exactly what they were taught.  How would they know any better?  They simply trusted an incompetent instructor.

I disagree to some extent; while there are certainly inadequate instructors, it's not always the instructor's fault that someone turns out to be a horrible-death-waiting-to-happen sort of diver. An instructor is only as good as the student will let him be; I think a lot more responsibility needs to be assigned to the divers themselves. Case in point: one of the guys (we'll call him Joe for the purposes of this illustration, even though that's not really his name) that I went through OW certification with.

Joe managed to make it all the way through the confined water and open water dives, successfully demonstrated all of the skills our instructors taught us, fulfilled every critiria to be considered Open Water certified by that particular agency. I went diving with Joe a few weeks after certification. I'll never go diving with him again, and here's why:

1. Joe has no use whatsoever for dive tables or computers. He can't even find his RDP, nor does he know where his dive log is. He just doesn't think it's all that important. I know for a fact that his instructor went over the importance of no-decompression limits and diving within the limits of the RDP or Wheel, because I was sitting right next to Joe when the instructor said it. Not a failure of training: a failure of personal responsibility.

2. Joe still cannot properly assemble his scuba unit without assistance. I had to show him how to put his regulator on the yoke valve of the tank and hand-tighten it down, had to show him how his power inflator worked (this is with the exact same BC he got certified in, which he was able to master "way back then"). I had the same instructor showing me how to do this during training; again, not a failure of training, a failure of personal responsibility.

3. Joe has no idea what a dive plan is, how to come up with one, how to plan for contingencies, or even why contingency planning is neccessary. As I was formulating the plan, determining what depth we were going to, what we were going to do when we got there, how long we were going to stay, and what we needed to do if we got seperated (it was a cruddy-visibility lake dive, around 10-15' of vis) or one of us had an air problem, I couldn't help but wonder where he was mentally when the instructor was teaching us how to do do all of this.

I could go on, but I'll make my point now: Joe and I had the same instructor, the same training, and got certified at the same time. I can plan a dive and dive the plan, safely and responsibly, and I know what I need to do if something goes wrong or I have a problem. I will dive solo before I ever get near another body of water with Joe, simply because I consider him a danger to himself and any unfortunate soul who happens to buddy with him. And it's not due to lack of training. It's due to lack of responsibilty.

Sure, there are poor instructors, but they don't always turn out poor divers. There are excellent instructors who don't always turn out excellent divers. Let's not be too quick to blame the training. Some of those poor folks that we read about in the accident reports simply failed to be responsible for their own personal safety.

As for a definition of "technical" versus "recreational", my point of demarcation is when you start planning the dive with something other than the recreational dive planner (or its equivalent). Diving within the limits of the RDP, that's rec diving to me. Break out the U.S. Navy manuals and/or tables, and we're getting technical now. The goal of the dive is mostly irrelevant to me; I'm just happier underwater. It's all recreation for me, technical or otherwise.

Cheers!

Jim


"Divemasters? We don't need no stinking divemasters!"

Edited by jholley309, 19 October 2005 - 05:33 PM.