84 replies to this topic

[PerroneFord]

I don't like 'em either, but this point of view doesn't seem to jive with your intention to eliminate 13 lbs of lead through use of a SS BP and negative tanks. What am I missing?

Only thing missing is the diver has made a choice to NOT use the optimal solution for a suit, requiring wearing more weight than should be needed, thus necessitating a non-optimal selection of other gear. Much as I would like to dive steel tanks right now, I can't because I am diving in a thin wetsuit. I could make the incorrect choice of diving big steel tanks, and then I would have to start doing all kinds of gyrations to keep from killing myself, like going to a double bladder and so forth.

The diver, with wieghts should be neutrally buoyant on the water, or slightly buoyant on the surface.

Neutral. Positive on the surface (assuming no air in the BC) will make slow ascents extremely difficult.

Agreed. This is why you work on your skills. I am slightly buoyant without my gear because I don't wear a weightbelt. My gear is about 3-6 pounds negative when my tanks are empty. I practice my stops from 9ft to 3ft. And no, it's NOT easy.

Edited by PerroneFord, 16 August 2006 - 09:20 AM.

[Dive_Girl]

Regarding weight belt selection, I quite like this one that Dive_Girl suggested in my Not Fade Away thread. Has anyone tried it? Is there another one worth recommending?

What's the cost? I like weight belts with pockets (you have more flexibility with regard to what weights you can use), but assuming you get a sturdy one that fits well, I'd go with the least expensive one.

Depending on how many pockets you go with, the price of a belt will range from $31 - $45US. This weight belt is the one we use in rental, so we have found it to be very sturdy. They have denier cordura pockets, resin coated nylon webbing, double needle stitching, and lLarge velcro.

I would recommend a stainless steel buckle ($5-$15US) - I think the standard belts come with plastic buckles, but the belt slides are all stainless steel.

[Walter]

Regarding weight belt selection, I quite like this one that Dive_Girl suggested in my Not Fade Away thread. Has anyone tried it? Is there another one worth recommending?

What's the cost? I like weight belts with pockets (you have more flexibility with regard to what weights you can use), but assuming you get a sturdy one that fits well, I'd go with the least expensive one.

Depending on how many pockets you go with, the price of a belt will range from $31 - $45US. This weight belt is the one we use in rental, so we have found it to be very sturdy. They have denier cordura pockets, resin coated nylon webbing, double needle stitching, and lLarge velcro.

I would recommend a stainless steel buckle ($5-$15US) - I think the standard belts come with plastic buckles, but the belt slides are all stainless steel.

Thanks for the feedback. I was just pricing some other pocketed weightbelts this past weekend, they were selling for about $18. I like the flexibility of being able to add and remore pockets, but I'm not sure I like it that much.

Why metal buckles? I've heard others recommend this, but my experience is plastic buckles hold as well as the metal ones. What am I missing?

[jextract]

Things to look for in a BC:

1. No padding - Padding requires additional weight, yet compresses at depth so it no longer cushions. Additionally, air in a BC lifts the BCs weight off your back rendering padding redundant. Padding also increases drag, making dives in current more difficult and increasing your air consumption.

I would caution on this, depending on the type of diving you do. Those of us who beach dive in cold water might disagree with this point. There's no way I'm taking a long hike across the sand with a tank and 30# of lead without some padding.

[annasea]

What's the cost? I like weight belts with pockets (you have more flexibility with regard to what weights you can use), but assuming you get a sturdy one that fits well, I'd go with the least expensive one.

Depending on how many pockets you go with, the price of a belt will range from $31 - $45US. This weight belt is the one we use in rental, so we have found it to be very sturdy. They have denier cordura pockets, resin coated nylon webbing, double needle stitching, and lLarge velcro.

I would recommend a stainless steel buckle ($5-$15US) - I think the standard belts come with plastic buckles, but the belt slides are all stainless steel.

Thanks for the feedback. I was just pricing some other pocketed weightbelts this past weekend, they were selling for about $18. I like the flexibility of being able to add and remore pockets, but I'm not sure I like it that much.

Why metal buckles? I've heard others recommend this, but my experience is plastic buckles hold as well as the metal ones. What am I missing?

I found Dive_Girl's XS Scuba weight belt on ScubaToys' website for $31.95 (4 pockets/20 lbs). When I called around to assorted LDSs yesterday, none of them carried it -- although one said they could probably order it in -- but I wouldn't be surprised if it'll be much more. So far, it's the least expensive one I've found. Other LDSs suggested Pinnacle, Scuba Pro and Sea Soft, but their prices range from $70 - $100.

Walter,

What's this weight belt you've discovered for $18?

Anyone,

What exactly does a weight integrated BC mean? If you're able to carry weight in your BC, isn't that the same as stuffing your BC pockets full of weight as I did during my check-out dives? Or is the difference that a weight integrated BC's pockets are detachable in case of an emergency? What is the average limit as to how much weight a weight integrated BC can hold?

And the term *back inflate*? Does that just mean that only the back of the BC becomes inflated so you don't experience that all-around *squeeze* when you inflate your vest? I'm guessing there's also a trim factor involved, too.

[Dive_Girl]

I found Dive_Girl's XS Scuba weight belt on ScubaToys' website for $31.95 (4 pockets/20 lbs). When I called around to assorted LDSs yesterday, none of them carried it -- although one said they could probably order it in -- but I wouldn't be surprised if it'll be much more. So far, it's the least expensive one I've found. Other LDSs suggested Pinnacle, Scuba Pro and Sea Soft, but their prices range from $70 - $100.

annasea - the price of the weight belt I quoted is just for the belt. It doesn't include the weights you need to add seperately. The Sea Soft belts are often belts with non ditchable weight sewn in, thus the major price difference.

Great questions/discussion being prompting here!

Weight usually runs $1.50-$2.50 a pound.

[annasea]

Get a backplate and wing. Don't say I didn't warn you!

<snip>

Hey Howard, I learned my lesson that first time you warned me. As for the BP/W, I'm definitely open to it, but I wonder if I'd be better off trying it in a pool first before I hit open water. (Or at least become comfortable with my buoyancy first.)

A weight integrated BC can be used with a weight belt so it offers more options in that way.
A weight integrated BC takes the wight off your hips and is carried by your shoulders when upright and distributed across your back when horizontial.
My first choice would be a BP/W but would also suggest looking at something like the Seaquest Balance if your looking for wing style with weight integration and padding.
A test you want to do with the BC options you look at is to take the BC with nothing attached and no air in it and place it on top of water.Those that sink mean less weight to be worn,those that float means you'll pack extra weight just to sink the BC.
If you'll be travelling fold up the BC and see how much space it will occupy in your suitcase.
I've got a 2nd BP/W that I can set up for single tank(unless you want to try some small doubbles)

Thx for the explanation and suggestions, Eric. Now about this 2nd BP/W of yours... where and when? I'm most interested!

[annasea]

I found Dive_Girl's XS Scuba weight belt on ScubaToys' website for $31.95 (4 pockets/20 lbs). When I called around to assorted LDSs yesterday, none of them carried it -- although one said they could probably order it in -- but I wouldn't be surprised if it'll be much more. So far, it's the least expensive one I've found. Other LDSs suggested Pinnacle, Scuba Pro and Sea Soft, but their prices range from $70 - $100.

annasea - the price of the weight belt I quoted is just for the belt. It doesn't include the weights you need to add seperately. The Sea Soft belts are often belts with non ditchable weight sewn in, thus the major price difference.

<snip>

Good point! Since I'm currently planning on non-local diving only, I'd be renting weights anyway.

[Dive_Girl]

Good point! Since I'm currently planning on non-local diving only, I'd be renting weights anyway.

Exactly!

[mantarraya]

Typically, a weight-integrated BC is set up with removable pockets in which you can put in ditchable weight (if you need to drop weight) and other permanent pouches where you can put weight that cannot be ditched. The removable and ditchable pouches are usually in the front torso area of the BC, so that you can get to them easy in the event you need to ditch weight. The permanent pouch location varies more, but typically it on the tank strap area. I put a little less than half my weight in the permanent pouches (the weight on your back can help you dive with a level stance in the water), and the rest in the ditchable pouches. You can generally fit one weight into each of the permanent pouches (size to be selected by you, but not TOO big of a weight as these pouches aren't that big), while you can fit 2 (maybe 3 if some of the weights are small) weights in each of the ditchable pouches.

Most jacket BCs are not back inflate. Air bladders integrated throughout the BC are inflated, giving you that lovely Michelin man look. A partial to full back-inflate BC has an air bladder(s) built onto the back of the BC so that all the inflation goes on there (or most of it, in the case of a partial back-inflation BC like the Seaquest Diva LX). The back inflate BC does not squeeze the body when inflated as tightly as a result.

[Walter]

I would caution on this, depending on the type of diving you do. Those of us who beach dive in cold water might disagree with this point. There's no way I'm taking a long hike across the sand with a tank and 30# of lead without some padding.

If you're diving in cold water, you have lots of padding in your exposure suit.

What exactly does a weight integrated BC mean?

Yes, you can put weights in any BC pocket, but a weight integrated BC is designed (or should be) to allow you to quickly and easily ditch the weight.

And the term *back inflate*? Does that just mean that only the back of the BC becomes inflated so you don't experience that all-around *squeeze* when you inflate your vest? I'm guessing there's also a trim factor involved, too.

Yes, the bladder is completely behind you. If one is getting squeezed with a vest, they're overinflating it. Either they are overweighted, creating a need for overinflation or they are uncomfortable in the water and over inflating to compensate.

Trim is best created by moving one's body, not by being over dependent on gear.

What's this weight belt you've discovered for $18?

I didn't catch the brand, but we saw it in the Keys at Divers Direct. She didn't buy one because we'll be back in two weeks and I think I can beat the price locally. I'll check local prices this week and get the brand name.

[Dive_Girl]

Why metal buckles? I've heard others recommend this, but my experience is plastic buckles hold as well as the metal ones. What am I missing

We've had plastic buckels break where the metal buckels we have, have not. I've also found the metal buckles to clamp down tighter, less likley to come unbuckled.

[Walter]

Thanks for the response, Nicolle.

[Latitude Adjustment]

Why metal buckles? I've heard others recommend this, but my experience is plastic buckles hold as well as the metal ones. What am I missing

We've had plastic buckels break where the metal buckels we have, have not. I've also found the metal buckles to clamp down tighter, less likley to come unbuckled.

I tried to convince Trace that the DIR way would be to eliminate that failure point by just tying the belt around one's waist but he didn't buy my logic.

I loaned my cold water BP&W to someone we all know, soon we will have converted her over to the dark side

[jextract]

I would caution on this, depending on the type of diving you do. Those of us who beach dive in cold water might disagree with this point. There's no way I'm taking a long hike across the sand with a tank and 30# of lead without some padding.

If you're diving in cold water, you have lots of padding in your exposure suit.

I'll take that trade off, thank you.