57 replies to this topic

[shadragon]

In another forum a lady diver said she was searching her area for "Real men" to dive with.

The obvious question is what constitutes a "Real man" in your mind. What attributes, personality make-up or other factors make a man worthy of consideration in your mind.

[drbill]

Hey, I resemble that!

One with no synthetic body parts and still breathing?

Edited by drbill, 12 February 2007 - 09:05 AM.

[mantarraya]

A real man is one that can make a woman feel like a real woman. Hard to define, but a woman definitely knows where her man makes her feel that way. I can't specifically define characteristics and traits, as many combinations can work.

[PerroneFord]

Why is it that the vast majority of things that make women happiest, seem to be "undefinable, or indescribable", but yet they expect men to not only be able to do them, but also to know when to do them and when they aren't doing it quite right?

I've always found this quite curious.

Another curiousity to me is that women invariable describe men as poor communicators in relationships, yet when men ask things like, "What's wrong?" the answer is often nothing, yet the woman expects the man to ignore this answer, *search his heart and mind*, figure out what's wrong, and then fix it.

Clearly these are stereotypes, but they are born of real scenarios played out in tens of thousands of relationships.

[shadragon]

Why is it that the vast majority of things that make women happiest, seem to be "undefinable, or indescribable", but yet they expect men to not only be able to do them, but also to know when to do them and when they aren't doing it quite right?

I've always found this quite curious.

I suspect if comprehension finally arrives it will only be moments before the scythe of the grim reaper makes its final blow. Ironic justice...

[Moose]

In another forum a lady diver said she was searching her area for "Real men" to dive with.

The obvious question is what constitutes a "Real man" in your mind. What attributes, personality make-up or other factors make a man worthy of consideration in your mind.

HEY, where's my can opener? And where did all these worms come from?

Seriously, this is a conversation that will grow legs and run away.

I would say that a real man is one of balance and poise. It’s not enough for a man to be all or nothing in any category. For example, if a man can fix a plumbing problem in a house, that is great. But if that is ALL he can do, he falls short on my scale.

A real man can…

Check email
Program a VCR clock
Hug
Put up sheetrock
Fix a string of Christmas lights without cursing
Milk a cow
Knows how to shut up and just listen when a women is upset
Change oil in his car
Be able to figure out a pretty good finical plan for himself (and family)
Save money
Spend money
Plant a garden
Reap crops from that same garden
Can talk a drunk down from a fight
Can protect himself if need be (but tries to walk away first)
Install a toilet in a basement
Votes
Has at least some understanding of Chinese and Taiwan relations
Serves on Jury duty
Understands the difference between “full time 4 wheel drive” and “all wheel drive”
Can match a fish dinner with a wine
Knows how to use duct tape and WD40
Always uses “sir” or “Ma’am” with strangers
Can talk intelligently about the Middle East
Opens doors for ALL women
Knows how to merge in traffic
Can finish a 1 LBS cheese burger
Does NOT have a criminal record
Knows the difference between Russia and the Soviet Union
Knows how to pick out a diamond
Can take a hit
Understands that any blood related injury, short of a missing appendage, can be fixed with a band-aid
Raise a dog and/or cat
Most importantly, be a friend to all that know him

[mantarraya]

Maybe it is not so undefinable after all. Moose's list looks pretty good to me...

[PerroneFord]

So are the women abdicating the responsibility of what THEY define as a real man, to the men?

[Moose]

A real man is one that can make a woman feel like a real woman. Hard to define, but a woman definitely knows where her man makes her feel that way. I can't specifically define characteristics and traits, as many combinations can work.

Yes, but this would be different from women to women. So a "real man" may only be found as such depending on the women he is with? That isn't right. A real man is a real man even in the absence of a woman.

[Moose]

Why is it that the vast majority of things that make women happiest, seem to be "undefinable, or indescribable", but yet they expect men to not only be able to do them, but also to know when to do them and when they aren't doing it quite right?

I've always found this quite curious.

Another curiousity to me is that women invariable describe men as poor communicators in relationships, yet when men ask things like, "What's wrong?" the answer is often nothing, yet the woman expects the man to ignore this answer, *search his heart and mind*, figure out what's wrong, and then fix it.

Clearly these are stereotypes, but they are born of real scenarios played out in tens of thousands of relationships.

Well put. Then add the fact that if you ask a women "what they want" you can't get a straight honest answer.

[Scubatooth]

Moose

good list Moose, i think the only one on that list im not to sure about is the milk the cow, but if given the run down i could probably take of that to.

i will agree on the "what they want" part as i wouldnt asking if i could read there mind.

Tooth

[shadragon]

A real man is a real man even in the absence of a woman.

(Bowing and scraping...)

We are not worthy... We are not worthy...

[mantarraya]

Yes, but this would be different from women to women. So a "real man" may only be found as such depending on the women he is with? That isn't right. A real man is a real man even in the absence of a woman.

Indeed, which is why what one woman views as a "real man" would not necessarily be what another woman sees as a "real man". We all have our individual preferences, so I am not sure that the terms "real man" and "real woman" are very meaningful at all. A "real man" shouls indeed still be a "real man" even in the absence of a woman, but if he is a "real man" in a way that does not attract a woman, what does that mean? Men always will wonder why they can't find a woman they want to be with long-term, just as women always wonder the same about men. The basic problem is that men and women don't communicate their needs and desires very well to each other. Like all of you men, I, too, wonder what could be done to enhance the ability of the sexes to communicate. But the bottom line is that we aren't really sure what draws us to the people we are drawn to. We just know it when we see it, provided we ever even give ourselves the chance to see it. Too often, we just don't open enough enough to give things a chance to happen. I've certainly done that more than once in the past, and had to make a conscious effort to try to change the way I presented myself, and interacted with men to finally get one I want to try to keep.

[PerroneFord]

The basic problem is that men and women don't communicate their needs and desires very well to each other. Like all of you men, I, too, wonder what could be done to enhance the ability of the sexes to communicate. But the bottom line is that we aren't really sure what draws us to the people we are drawn to. We just know it when we see it, provided we ever even give ourselves the chance to see it.

I don't know that I agree. I think men are VERY communicative about what we like, and don't like. And what we desire in the women we choose to date. Where it falls down, is that we are often discouraged from articulting those desires by women. Our comments are viewed as sexist, shallow, unfair, etc. If, in mixed company, a man walks by and a woman at the table comments that he has a "nice ass", its a giggle for all the women. If a woman walks past and a man makes the same comment, he's sexist.

I think if we are to improve communication between the sexes, women are going to actually have to LISTEN to what the guys are saying, and the men are going to have to ask things and need to be able to get a real answer and not a sarcastic remark, or a vague response.

Clearly, this is just my view as one man. Others will certainly feel differently.

-P

[Moose]

but if he is a "real man" in a way that does not attract a woman

This is what I've dealt with all my life. I realize that my chosen profession will most likely leave me single for my entire life. Lets face it, not many women want to be with a man that spent half his life learning on our to kill someone, and the other half learning to save them. Not to mention that I'm always "on call." It's not uncommon for me to get a call in the middle of the night, and then within 12 hours, be in some hotspot in the armpit of the world. Oh, I can’t discuss what I’m doing there or even where exactly I am.

It’s not really conducive to healthy relationship. This is one of the reasons I’ve resigned myself to just being single for the rest of my life. (That is until Sunshinediver’s proposition!)