107 replies to this topic

[Walter]

I plan to place posts in other categories in the Best of the best forum if I ever get away from the 12 hour days at work. If you have suggestions for threads to summarized, send a PM (or e-mail - Walter@singledivers.com) to me.

[randy54]

The dive boats I use here in SoCal normally have you kneel on the dive step, lift a leg and they take off your fins. Walter said he thought it was hard to stand back up, but I've never had a problem, in full wet or drysuit, and heavy gloves. Also the attendent puts your fins up on the deck. Yes Walter, I know you think this is dumb, but not having the fins hanging off my wrist, I'm better able to grap the ladder and climb up. We often have rough water exits, and I've never seen anyone fall off, or hear of any stories, which would be rampant, if this was a problem. I know the boats I dove from in warm water didn't have swim steps to do this from, and so I follow whatever the rule of the boat is. All boats want you to stay away from the step or ladder until there clear. They all want you to keep mask on and reg in mouth, and most ask you to deflate you BC. Fins seem to be an issue each boat/operator has a preferance in the way they want you to deal with them.

[Walter]

Randy,

I've heard of that method, it takes a simple task and complicates it. I've been diving in rough seas, that's the wrong time to be kneeling and trying to get up with full gear. It's also a solution to a problem that doesn't exist. BTW, with your fins over your wrists, they are not in the way of your hands grasping the ladder.

[Diverbrian]

Randy,

I've heard of that method, it takes a simple task and complicates it.  I've been diving in rough seas, that's the wrong time to be kneeling and trying to get up with full gear.  It's also a solution to a problem that doesn't exist.  BTW, with your fins over your wrists, they are not in the way of your hands grasping the ladder.

I second Walter's view. That is one great reason for open heel fins. Mine ride beautifully on my wrist as I climb the ladder. I have had to reboard in 4-6 ft. waves and anything that simplified the job was appreciated. I was grateful that our instructors train divers to board a boat in much the way that Walter suggests. As it was, on one entry I had bruises across my chest from the "bucking bronco" ladder. And I have had dive buddies fall off the ladder on re-boarding. It happens.

[hnladue]

My fins DO get in the way when I'm climbing up the ladder... I prefer to hand them up. My hands are small enough, that the fins really hamper grabbing the ladder. One place I dive with actually has you remove all your gear before climbing up the ladder... I really enjoy that!! Less weight.

[Diverbrian]

My fins DO get in the way when I'm climbing up the ladder... I prefer to hand them up. My hands are small enough, that the fins really hamper grabbing the ladder. One place I dive with actually has you remove all your gear before climbing up the ladder... I really enjoy that!! Less weight.

Yep, I could envision climbing onboard without those doubles (my back thanks me for the thought ). I just haven't dove with any boats that do it that way.

I forget the advantage to having my knuckles drag on the ground. The arms are long enough to keep the fins away from the ladder.

[Walter]

Arm length isn't a factor, neither is hand size. What could be a problem is a poorly designed fin that doesn't slide down out of the way.

[hnladue]

Nope.. I use split fins... I'm short, my arms are short--the fins are the same length as my arms, so they get in the way. Just doesn't work for me, easily anyhow, to climb onnboard with my fins. Argue with me all you want Walter... I know what causes MY issues.

[jextract]

Randy,

I've heard of that method, it takes a simple task and complicates it.  I've been diving in rough seas, that's the wrong time to be kneeling and trying to get up with full gear.  It's also a solution to a problem that doesn't exist.  BTW, with your fins over your wrists, they are not in the way of your hands grasping the ladder.

I second Walter's view. That is one great reason for open heel fins. Mine ride beautifully on my wrist as I climb the ladder. I have had to reboard in 4-6 ft. waves and anything that simplified the job was appreciated. I was grateful that our instructors train divers to board a boat in much the way that Walter suggests. As it was, on one entry I had bruises across my chest from the "bucking bronco" ladder. And I have had dive buddies fall off the ladder on re-boarding. It happens.

Yet another reason, by the way, to keep that reg in your mouth and mask on your face until you're seated. If you slip and go face-first into the ladder or the boat, the reg and mask will protect your mouth and face from an otherwise rather abrupt introduction to physics.

[Walter]

Darlin',

I don't want to argue with you at all. You'll be safer if you can climb the ladder while retaining control of your fins. If you want to figure out how to accomplish this, we'll continue. If you don't, we won't.

OTOH, I would like to understand what you mean. I love learning new things. I'm not getting a mental picture that's helping me to understand what happens when you try to climb the ladder with your fins on your wrists.

You say:

My hands are small enough, that the fins really hamper grabbing the ladder.

I understand how small hands can make grasping a ladder difficult if the hand holds are too thick. I don't understand how fins hanging from your wrists down by your body will make grabbing the ladder more difficult. Please paint me a picture in words.

You then say:

I'm short, my arms are short--the fins are the same length as my arms, so they get in the way.

Again, I don't understand how your arm length to fin length ratio is a factor. Fins do hang down in front and can get in the way of your legs as you lift your knees to climb the ladder, but for me and for all my students it's merely been a short time learning to climb between the fins rather than trying to climb behind them. I'm obviously missing something, please let me know what.

[RICHinNC]

I like to think we are all entitled to our opinions......and the right to express them without any problems....

On the boats I regularly dive in NC, you come up at the rear of the tag line from your deco stop on the bar....or near it. (thats a whole other subject). Keeping the reg in your mouth you take off one fin and run your hand of choice through the loop. Do the same with the other fin. Then using the tag line...you pull up to the ladder and time the swells so that the ladder is fully "down" before you grab onto it and pull into it planting your feet.

NO ONE comes up tight behind you in case you loose your grip and fall back. If you do loose your grip you arch your back and try to get as far away from the ladder as possible so it doesnt whack you on one of its "down" cycles. Hopefully, no one was under you and got to eat your tank.

I have seen people try to take their fins off holding on to the ladder, as I have seen recommended here, and they paid dearly for their attempts. If thats the way you want to do it...fine. It is just not a method I would recommend if you come to NC. Each to his own.

As far as the reg goes....it does not leave my mouth until I am well on the boat. I once saw someone just clear the ladder and the boat swung around in a swell and he was tossed right back in the water. He had spit his reg out on the last rung of the ladder and he dang near drowned before he could get it back.

Again....like I tell the soldiers I train....do what you think the rank on your collar and the $$$ in your wallet can handle.

rich

[Dennis]

Dennis,

My Dive Rite Fins come with the spring strap. I have really come to enjoy the ease of getting fins on and off and the strap around my wrist to climb ladders. Others on the boat notice and ask me about that strap as they notice how easily it works out for me.

Good luck,

Brian

Brian,

I use Jet Fins, so unless I want to spend as much for the straps as I spent on my fins, I will need to make some. I just have to get the time and materials to do it.

[peterbj7]

Jet fins are available with spring straps already fitted. Or they are in the UK.

[peterbj7]

As far as the reg goes....it does not leave my mouth until I am well on the boat. I once saw someone just clear the ladder and the boat swung around in a swell and he was tossed right back in the water. He had spit his reg out on the last rung of the ladder and he dang near drowned before he could get it back.

I often keep my reg in my mouth on the way up for two reasons, and neither is the reason Rich describes - (1) it prevents me breathing diesel fumes, and (2) if it's in my mouth it isn't dangling to catch on something. The way he and most of us have described exits is certainly right for rough "cold" water, but depends of course on the tag line being attached very close to the ladder. On many boats I've seen it isn't, leaving a "no man's land" to be negotiated somehow.

In warm water such as here in Belize many people choose to use full foot fins, which of course can't be looped over the wrist. And many of these divers are inexperienced. In these circumstances it's normal to get to the ladder and securely on it, then to remove the fins and hand them up, or to a staff member nearby. Holding on to them is a possibility, but that would mean climbing the ladder with one hand either not on the ladder or having a tenuous hold on it. For this reason I always ensure a staff member stays in the water near (but not under) the person exiting, to provide immediate assistance if needed. With difficult conditions and inexperienced divers the staff member often assists in removing the fins.

Different circumstances require different solutions.

[hnladue]

Walter.... Brian has dove with me and can probably explain better then me as he see's me climb the ladder. When I put my fins on my wrist (and I usually put both on the right side) then try to grab the ladder, they actually stick out enough (part where the front of your foot enters the fin) to where grabbing the ladder is difficult. My hands can hardly make it around the ladder as it is, and I can't get the fins up high enough on my wrist with totally undoing them(I'm fat!). OK now I've got a hold of the ladder and the fins are wedged between me and the ladder.... now try to climb it. Can't pick up a legs, fins in the way. Try to swing fins to outside, lose grip on ladder. If I could sling them to my head it would be better!!! I kick very well without my fins, surprisingly! So losing them wouldn't make me panic. I lost a fin at 100ft one time, just turned around on my head, swooped down and grabbed it before it hit bottom at 110ft. I was with Rhonda at the time and she couldn't believe I grabbed it that fast. I only had to drop about 3 ft to get it. I hope to dive sometime with you Walter.... maybe them you can see what I'm talking about!! Of course if it's down there in Fla, all bets are off cause up here I dive in a 7mil-feel like the stay-puft marchmellow man-suit.